Scion Rights!

[DarkFox]

Scout, a lot of old a very real vets wanted the mauler head bob back in, not a bunch of clueless noobs.

re: Scion v ISDF balance, it is indeed a bit messed up, but I think this is from the benefits ISDF gain from the new AI.
Why don't scions get these benefits? obvious really... their ships morph at stupid times when under AI control. I asked a million times for this to be fixed, but apparently it's ken code, and ken's been away for quite a while.

Ever watched an AI sonic scout attack an extractor? or an AI arc scout attack a base?
Laughable...

[SilverB1rd]

The scions are better about that now, you can force them to stay morphed or unmorphed

[MowerMan]

Put a few archers in the right spot with poppers, and apc and bomber will never make it to your base.

[DarkFox]

I'm so sorry, I can't believe I missed the morphing option despite the games I've played so far with the public 1.3 release. That 'force morph' option is awesome, just the ticket.

[Zero Angel]

Scions morph time has been lowered from 5 to 3 seconds. Knowing a lot of vets who are really good with 1.2 scions, I dont think we really need to give them a whole lot of goodies; they practically win at blink.

[Jwk the Hemp Monkey]

Scions are now at a serious disatvantage due to the new improved AI. One to one scions were a serious challenge, And this was ballenced by the relativly low number of units.

Its their task-specitif units and style which incorperates 'anti-weapon type shields' and other such stuff which gives them the edge. And also what attracts them to only a few players, due to the relativly high level of challenge it is to control them properly.

However, when its one scion vs 4or 5 ISDf units, mostly AI, the situation is a little different.

One imidiate thing that springs to mind is improving the Lancer as an anti-mortar bike ship (which i believe is what it was always ment to be). How affective it is now? Mortar bikes are going to be one of 'the most' serious threats there is. Just 5 min ago i tested 4 bikes vs a single spire, they destroyed it and lost one ship , and yellowed another.

Also, small things like given jammers the abilty to target things on the HUD's of the commanders (like a scout) could really make the difference for a scion commander.

These things need to be solved as quickly as possiable, and leaving them till after allthe bugs are fixed? sure, but leaving them till after all the AI and other factors that affect ship performance is not such a good idea IMO.

Oh,...and why the hell would someone want to remove the mauler bob? It rocked! you felt like a Horse of Death charging into battle, the fact you could not aim did not matter, because you only have short range weapons (fang, arc and lol sonic wave). It was cool. Some people get sick? so what! Go to F3 mod or dont go into a mauler at all lol

[Zero Angel]

Thats funny, all my tests show that AI mortar bikes get completely and utterly owned by gunspires.

[Dirty Rooster]

As far as I have seen, Mbikes still get chewed up by spires..

And forced-unmorph units can't shoot at lungs ... wierd stuff.

I want/wanted Mauler head-bob in and argued for it so much
(maybe 2 or 3 posts) that I was threatened to shut up about it
by Nathan.

[BZZERKER]

Hemp, The Mauler Head-bob issue got warm enough in beta to actually have the topic locked, but only cause DR annoyed GSH. I think there were 4-5 ppl (myself included) that asked for it back. The final answer we got was "If Ken gets around to your request, great. If not, please realize he's not had time or interest to work on BZ2 much recently, and there are higher priority bugs". This was shorty before release of PB1.

[Jwk the Hemp Monkey]

My test was in single player, so it might of been wrong. I thought it was odd as well.

As to the mauler head bob, why the hell was it taken out in the first place? And whats this about GSH throwing his weight around again? Over things like flying...sure, but head bobing on the maulers? ...seesh, hes not the fountain of knowladge ffs.

oh no! aaargh! i can almost feel the ' thread locked/post modified and deletaed' shot gun being loaded and aimed squarely at my fingers! god forbid their be any postive critism. [/sarcasm]

[Commando]

Hemp Monkey GSH did not change the mauler.  Ken did, that is why GSH doesn't want to hear about it.  If he changed the mauler, he would probably change it back.  Read the freaking changelog before you blame anyone for anything, this applies to anyone that wants to blame GSH for the physics, the mauler, and any other non netcode related code.  Read the changelog so you can find out who actually changed a certain aspect of the game.

[Jwk the Hemp Monkey]

I am as of this moment reading it. And i did not say GSH changed it....i said that going on what beserker said, its sounds like another point of stress that could of been avoided....e.g. not locking a fourm topic when people are obviously concerned about it.

when fourm threads are locked, the problem does not go away, its just burned deeper into the hearts of those involved.

It basically comes down to not only some peoples urge to get control over other people (yes, it does exist, my dad is a professional psychologist / theologian and poet, there are people addicted to the feeling of control),

But also to the fact that I thought moderators were here to :

A) Help the rest of a community find a solution to a problem/share their opinions
B)Add their help and support to the communities

If the moderators disagree with something, and then lock a thread/edit a post because they do not like what it is saying, then they are doing something wrong.

They do not hold absolute truth, so therefore they are wrong about something(s), if that is true, then how can locking every thread they do not like (and in some cases not even giving the identity of the locker so that no one can even privately complain) be a good thing?

ANYWAY, I do not want to see this important issue get drowned in politics.

[DarkFox]

On the issue of scions being balanced in 1.3 - I think they're just fine as they are. Blink is godly, it's amazing, all the scion shortcomings put together (range problems, early game problems, scout firepower, lack of pool supression, etc) are worth that one weapon.

If you want to BEAT blink, try using serviced assault tanks with blast, they really are the best weapon ISDF have against blink. Praying may also help.

[technoid]

Praying may also help.

[/size]Can I get that from the Stronghold?  

[BZ FeebleEffort]

"I want/wanted Mauler head-bob in and argued for it so much
(maybe 2 or 3 posts) that I was threatened to shut up about it
by Nathan."

hehehehe welcome to my world.

And Co and Greenheart...stop trying to diflect responsiblity from Nathn by what things he did or did not change purely by the (NM)/ (KM) Notations in the changelog..This was Nathans Patch...95% of the ideas, impetus and effort was his, Kens involvement was a favor to nathan, his involvment was early(on physics and some weapon tweaks) then late with a few last minute changes.

True...Nathan didn't do the physics coe..but he was the lrge part of that whoel decision(right or wrong depending how you look at it) and IF Ken made a change and it was negatively recieved, Nahtn could have easily conveyed to ken "Hey..Ken..that didn't work so good"


Ken has told me he pays virtually no(underline ZERO) attention to the boards. He recieved virtually all "usesful information form personal contact.


I don't think I saw 10 posts from him in the entire beta board.


Knowing this, It makes Nathan(as project director) responsible to relay player feedback to the appropriate dept and make corrections. That for reasons unknown, didn't happened, or it did happen, and Ken ignored it(which does not fit his personality from what I've seen).

I don't use "responsible" in a BLAME sorta way...I use it in a "Management" kinda way.