1.3 Developers Please Read

[OvermindDL1]

What Zero Angel is doing is not altering the AI itself, he is changing the units to use other preset AI.  Again, altering the AI is impossible except on Native Source which no one in the community has access to except for the developer, and he has not the skill to work on it.

Also, there is no need to stand up for me, I am just slightly more irritable right now and have little to no tolerence for a blantent display of a lack of intellegence due to being rather sick...

[PhoeniX-FlamE]

well, I'm all up for otpions if you can get it to work

personaly, I think it will be ridicouls but sure, if its an option go ahead

[Wingflier]

Heh.  

How would that even be possible?[to make the AI better]

I don't have to defend myself...he said it himself.

The truth is nobody cares a bit what you agree or disagree with...

Who died and made you God?  There are people who care about my opinion and even agree with me.  

If anybody you are the person here with the unbacked opinions and illogical beliefs...

You, as with many people on this board...
Seem to believe you can prove all these things with no evidence.

Go ahead and post about how I am so wrong.

But please try to back it up so I don't have to waste my time like this arguing with you guys.

Nah, forget it...I'm not arguing with you guys anymore...

I made this post...it was a suggestion...you either agree or disagree...

And you post it.

Period.

[GW05]

Hey Wing, IF you think it's possible and IF you get it up and running, I'll surely give it a try.

[DarkFox]

OM - we're getting onto the age-old debate of defining AI. If AI is making the computer act more like a human would (which I believe it is) then ZA's scout mods certainly make the scout act more like a human (weapon switching, dodging more erratically etc). I'd call that an AI improvement, even if it's not improved code. I fully understand where you're coming from though.

Wingflier - nobody made me god, but you certainly made yourself a laughing stock by claiming that a human could beat a computer whose AI was made as competitive as the programmers could make it, and as such a *lot* of people (read: most) don't value your opinions here because of it. You've perpetuated the problem by repeating and rewording the issue in this topic.

[MowerMan]

Hey ya gotta admit DF, I was being kind of nice to WF (especially for ME!!!), even if I misinterpreted his intent (but the more he posts, the less I think I misinterpreted).  Heh heh heh...

[PhoeniX-FlamE]

wing, ur starting hoot with almost all of the most respeceted people in bz2

[Zero Angel]

Lets look at it from a different angle:

Wing, the two developers have worked hundreds of man-hours (total of 4 years) on the bug fix aspects of this patch alone. What you're proposing is an almost complete rewrite of the AI to suit your needs.

The question is this: Do you really want the developers to put in another 2 years rewriting the AI, then fixing the new bugs that the rewrite causes, just so you can have a little bit more fun?

I know I dont want to wait another 2 years for the patch, and i'm certain that the devs dont want to spend that much more time either on *your* request.  These people are very busy professional programmers who are doing this in their own spare time, so be grateful for that as it is.

[GW05]

Hey ZA, this is just for my reference, but, if a majority of the members here has the same opinion as Wingflier, would another patch be in the question?

[Zero Angel]

No, I dont think so. The developers were real hard on putting in too much extra work re: the hover issue and Nathan in particular made it clear that he doesnt want people thinking they have the right to write blank cheques on his spare time.

I really dont think they would work on another patch for that purpose. We'll just have to enjoy what bug fixes and enhancements we already get.

Re: AI issues, a few of use modders are already trying to get some of existing problems solved. Especially re: Rocket/MorphTank AI bugs and the idiotic spinning in circles that the Scout/Sentry/AttackTaskP AIs do, providing it doesnt open up a whole other can of worms.

[OvermindDL1]

When I speak of AI I refer to the only thing that the code refers to, the actions of the defined behaviours (I.E. rockettankai), those are hard coded and near impossible to enhance even in-code.  Putting different AI's onto other ODF's does not change AI, it only causes the unit to follow another path of reasoning.

[Wingflier]

I understand that this is asking a lot of the programmers.  

That is why I wanted feedback.

Thank you for making me aware...

I got the point.

Adam

[Avatar]

OM - we're getting onto the age-old debate of defining AI. If AI is making the computer act more like a human would (which I believe it is) then ZA's scout mods certainly make the scout act more like a human (weapon switching, dodging more erratically etc). I'd call that an AI improvement, even if it's not improved code. I fully understand where you're coming from though.

That's an excellent definition of 'good AI'.  It's VERY easy to make an AI that points at the human and pulls the trigger.  Even easier to make weapons that never miss.

Making it seem like there's a human controlling the other ships is the whole point, not making it seem like God is driving it...  

As to the existance of 'improved AI' ships, by now everyone should know that I like options.  The existence of any optional assets for the game is overall a good thing regardless of popularity or perceived usefulness by any one factor of the community.  Someone will find a use of it along the lines of 'if you build it, they will come'...

The more pieces we have the richer the overall experience.

And WF needs to look up "beating a dead horse" in the slang dictionary...

And Mower, buddy, what's wrong?  There was a beautiful, shiny chromed glistening chain just hanging there, begging you to jerk it...

tsk, tsk, in the old days you would never have let that slide by...



-Av-

[MowerMan]

Heh heh heh Av...  I'm trying to be a kinder, gentler, MowerMan.

WF has made himself somewhat of a target, but overall I think he is an OK guy.  He is somewhat of a loudmouth, but somehow, I find that kind of endearing (ha ha ha, I wonder why?).

[technoid]

Note, game AI is not true AI per se.  We have yet to achieve fully wrought self-thinking machines, although there have been some progress.  "AI" in $40-$50 computer games just have enough code to create a pseudo-environment where bots simulate human movements.  Consider commercial PC game AI as much closer to Artificial Instinct, rather than Artificial Intelligence.