Is it possible to cheat in multiplayer?

[bigbadbogie]

awww.. dont ruin the bout cmdo..... ZA vs Sonic - at least 15 rounds plz 

[Sonic]

If you want any chance of the flying being restored as an option of any kind, Ken is the person to bring it up to.  He is the one who fixed the exploit and he is the one in charge of physics.  GSH tried, but as Nielk said, caused major glitches.  Basically the engine would throw you at insane speeds.  If thrown into an object, such as an extractor, the force would kill your scout.

I would love to see an odf option added to [CraftClass] to address this very issue.

[CraftClass]
use12Reverse = false // True enabling 1.2's reverse code
use12Strafe = false // True enabling 1.2's strafe code

Both enabling flying like in 1.2.

I get the strange feeling in the web of code that we call BZ2, that would cause far more hell than its worth...

[Nielk1]

It seems that upward and downward thrust is cut when you reach a certain height above the terrain. It also appears that this limit is for the final vector of total force rather than the individual forward and backward thrust.

I think that if possable, we should be able to get the thrust down back. As it is now, in a 0 gravity map, if you go a tiny bit too high, it is VERY hard to get your ship to come back down. Though a week gravity does seem to account for this.

The way I suspect it is coded is to take the velocity vector and cut off the z axis.

[Zero Angel]

Seems reasonable. I noticed that during testing too.

[Avatar]

I once watched Mowerman fly around the Titan DM map in a mortarbike for hours.  He'd swoop down and pick up ammo when needed and was pretty much unhittable.  OTOH he couldn't really hit anything either, other than mortar the occasional pilot on foot.  We were all trying to snipe him and he'd swoop down to point-blank mortar someone if he could see them...  that was a blast, sortof the BZ2 version of Stomp...

IOW given how much ammo each ship holds I'm still amazed that hovering a base in a Scout could be effective...  even in God mode I can't destroy a whole base with a Scout without endlessly running back for ammo.  Weird...

Anyway, there's no need to change anything or bring Ken into it.  The only restriction on flying/hovering is that you can't do it literally forever.  I have scouts that can stay up almost forever, can arc like crazy, and while yes I'm not a 'Vet' I'm more than willing to work with anyone who'll have me to make the physics as close to 1.2 as possible.  After that it's up to the Vets to accept the change.

OTOH as we've said, they're a tight community that already has what they like and a set of rules to avoid the other exploits and crashes, so there shouldn't be a problem with them hanging with 1.2 forever.  It's not like anyone's going to disable 1.2 despite some of the inappropriate comments above about 'bot crashing 1.2 games.

I'd really really really like to see that sort of thing REMOVED from this thread, it's not funny and has no real place here...  not if we're trying to have a civil conversation AND solve issues rather than just start flame wars and keep the B$ flowing.

Like I've said, the only real problem I've had in the past with the "Established MP Human Strat Playing Community" is the attitude they've displayed.  That aside I take their needs and wants seriously and fully support their right to fight for what they love in this game, as I do any fellow BZ addict.

-Av-

[Red Devil]

From my experience, I think a lot of people like to stay 'in the box'. They don't like to experiment or see change of any kind. 

If it makes them venture outside their established routine, techniques, strategies, tactics, whatever, their safety zone feels threatened and it's immediately attacked (kind of like how one of my dogs reacts if he sees something the least bit different).

I'm not sure if it's due to a lack of imagination or just an innate fear of change.

[mrtwosheds]

IOW given how much ammo each ship holds I'm still amazed that hovering a base in a Scout could be effective...  even in God mode I can't destroy a whole base with a Scout without endlessly running back for ammo.  Weird...

They don't destroy a whole base, they prevent it from ever being constructed, then get tanks and finish it. Maybe 1 in 30 games someone uses an assault tank to take down a base. And yes the commander builds countless pods, even when the bay is built.

A failure by both teams to prevent enemy base construction is known as "a good game" they are fairly rare.

[Nielk1]

How sad...

In 1.3 I send in AI scouts from at least 2 enterances at a time to stir the enemy up. I also am sure to destroy every scav I find right away.

Doing so makes the game challenging but also ensures that it won't end with only a rec in one base.

[Commando]

I get the strange feeling in the web of code that we call BZ2, that would cause far more hell than its worth...

We might have three players in 1.3 on a given day.  That is on a good day.  The 1.2 community is much more active and it adding such a setting would get them to migrate to 1.3, I would welcome it.  In the past I was completely against flying, but now that I see most of the anti-flying group has abandoned this game, I'm starting to side with the flyer crowd since they are still around.  The side's credibility pretty much left with the group, imo.

[Sonic]

I don't feel my bot comments are inappropriate, they simply state the true risks of running 1.2 and what someone could do if they were really bored or really determined. There were already bots that targeted THIS server in the past with individuals who didn't like CmptrWz and other individuals who just joined 1.2 games to crash 'em, so it's not unrealistic that one day someone might pull of this kind of stunt.

This is no diffrent than posting up security advisories that say "Hey, SMF 1.1.3 has has a SQL Injection Vulnerability which allows an attacker to do <blah>".

[Avatar]

They're inappropriate in this setting because we're trying hard not to devolve into flames.  I'm sure someone will post that sort of remark out of context on a clan board, stating something like "See, they're planning on forcing everyone to go to 1.3 by making 1.2 unplayable" or some such crazy thing.  Don't give them that sort of ammunition.

They'd be very appropriate comments in a thread about defending 1.2, as they'd be informative of strategies someone could use to take down 1.2.  Here, though, they just throw gasoline on a fire that'll never stop smoldering.

I see them as very similar to Nathan stating "blah blah blah that crashes 1.2 has been fixed" in the changelog.  He caught holy hell for that, along the lines of 'what were you thinking writing that???'.  Not a good idea...

Anyway, the whole flying thing is a moot point as given their adamant removal of it I can't see Ken (who's MIA again) or Nathan adding it back in as a switch.  I think the idea of making a 'Vet Recycler Variant' is a much better solution, as massive tweaking can be done to virtually everything that way as needed to satisfy the intended audience.

-Av-

[Red Devil]

Not only do I think Scout hovering is dumb, but it also *looks* dumb. 

People can call it a 'skill' if they like, but, if that's a skill, then so is wall glitching, G15 macros for BF2, and 'ghosting', which are just ways of exploiting weaknesses in the code to avoid being hit.

People who call it a skill are just fooling themselves, not me.

[Commando]

What's so bad about G15 macros?  I agree flying is a bug but from what I read rocket jumping in Quake was a bug too.  It was removed in Quake 2 and restored in Quake 3.  Removing a bug can be detrimental if the community at large uses it.  I'm not saying add the bug back into stock units.  I'm just saying a switch to enable or disable said bug would be useful in bringing in the vets.

[Steeveeo]

I think the idea of making a 'Vet Recycler Variant' is a much better solution, as massive tweaking can be done to virtually everything that way as needed to satisfy the intended audience.

Agreed, after seeing that odf switch I thought about making a subvariant in the SRV mod I was going to throw together a "Vet-mode" variant or something of the like.

[Nielk1]

I just want them to make it cut positive Z-axis velocity (instead of both) so I can still fly down.

That odf switch was a sugestion, not a real command.