Battlezone Universe

Battlezone Universe => Archive Vault => 1.3 Public Beta 5: Tech Alpha 5 => Topic started by: Killer AK on August 09, 2009, 07:37:22 PM

Title: Sabre problems
Post by: Killer AK on August 09, 2009, 07:37:22 PM
is it me in 1.3 games the sabres are more retarded in combat than scavagers?
I am noticing they are driving to far past thier target and when u tell them to attack a target they drive left right and like 2 sabres in the group attack where as the sabres the others are too busy driving around doing nothing but taking shots.
am i the only one who see's this
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Killer AK on August 09, 2009, 07:37:56 PM
1.3techalpha5
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Rocket on August 09, 2009, 11:30:35 PM
yeah, i've noticed that it's very irritating sometimes...

i developed a heavy assault hover unit, and it takes them FOREVER to circle around something so that they are "all happy" with their positions.... and THEN they attack...

gets kinda annoying when you tell them to attack a gun tower....  :roll:

but yeah, even with the faster units, it's sometimes a little annoying watching them.

i believe those tactics are in the earlier versions too...

i think someone with a c++ machine needs to pull out their magic wand.  :lol:
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: GSH on August 10, 2009, 02:26:18 PM
There was a problem like this for a while when tunnels were briefly added to some objects (guntowers, I think) in private betas. It helped scavs path around those objects, but some units took really long paths to get to them. Things were better when this was reverted, but it took a while for the alternate problem to be noticed.

Debugging AI and pathing is extremely time-intensive, and not fun. Uselessly vague reports like "something bad happened to me one day" don't help get any problem solved. Programming isn't just some magic wand. It's a LOT of work.

-- GSH
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Rocket on August 10, 2009, 07:54:40 PM
Quotei think someone with a c++ machine needs to pull out their magic wand. :lol:
Quote from: GSH on August 10, 2009, 02:26:18 PM
Programming isn't just some magic wand. It's a LOT of work.

-- GSH

actually, i was joking, hence the smiley after that sentence....
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: AHadley on August 11, 2009, 12:05:56 PM
Don't worry about it, GSH doesn't appreciate it being implied that he doesn't do any work :lol:
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Mr X on August 22, 2009, 11:49:31 AM
Its odd, but sabres are usually like that, yet recently in a game they temporarily overcame this fault and beat the hell out of some rocket tanks supported by turrets and service trucks. That was the only bit of luck I had in that game though...stupid rocket tanks getting stuck in my buildings...
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Rocket on August 22, 2009, 11:57:12 AM
insidently, any chance of "weaponMask" being fixed so it works with more vehicle types, in the next patch?
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: TheJamsh on August 22, 2009, 01:39:34 PM
use it with MorphTankFriend/Enemy ainames and it works.

MorphTankFriend/Enemy paths better too. And NO, it doesnt make sabres morph.
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Rocket on August 22, 2009, 04:30:33 PM
Quote from: TheJamsh on August 22, 2009, 01:39:34 PM
use it with MorphTankFriend/Enemy ainames and it works.

MorphTankFriend/Enemy paths better too. And NO, it doesnt make sabres morph.

so you're saying that there's a way to make a MorphTankFriend/Enemy that doesn't morph?
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: bb1 on August 22, 2009, 06:03:05 PM
That is the AI name for it, rather than the classlabel. Classlabel morphtank makes it morph, the AI for it just controls the behavior. It will "try" to morph into assault mode, but the instructions for that won't be possible to execute and it will just attack better.
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Sabre Tank on August 30, 2009, 01:07:57 PM
I have noticed this also....It gets very frustrating when you have a group of them..tell them to attack and maybe 2 or 3 shoot once at the target then spin around while the rest are still driving 4 miles past the enemy... while any others may be circiling around it and not shoot at all....and then just maybe the time they decide to shoot is just before they get blown to hoot. Well maybe not like that situation, but that's how I've seen it happen.
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Rocket on August 30, 2009, 11:25:22 PM
thanks TJ and BB1, i'm using MorphTankFriend/Enemy, and it's tons better!  :-)
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: TheJamsh on August 31, 2009, 02:34:44 AM
Just a little FYI as well, SupportProcess will make vehicles go absolutely beserk if you dont use an attackTask and subAttackTask with it. I found this out with my new mantichora unit for my rec variant. It would hunt you to the end of the earth, but it could never shoot you...

AI Processes and things are a bit difficult at times, you've just got to experiment to see what works best. In my experience morphtankfriend/enemy is a VERY good AI process, it can even use locking weapons which a lot of other classes can't.
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Mr X on August 31, 2009, 12:35:15 PM
I've decided, sabres are only good for scav hunting or scav escort duty :P
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Avatar on September 03, 2009, 06:47:34 PM
I've been using groups of ten Sabres in one of the GH Instant maps and they do exactly as stated.   Two Sabres will attack head on, the rest will go around the target and travel up to several hundred meters before turning around to attack.  Of course, they do this in a conga line and the lead turns first, running into his followers.

It quickly devolves into a three stooges routine.

I've found it much better to tell them to go somewhere instead of using the attack command.  When they get where they're going they'll turn and attack whatever's around.  Makes them much more effective, not at all like the lemmings they usually act like.

-Av-
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: lucky_foot on September 04, 2009, 11:05:12 AM
Nielk1 and I played a match online on one of GH's maps and on attacking a mega statue they did the same thing, the first few thinking it was great to attack, but the others almost waiting for their turn to shoot.

I was watching from satellite (as I was base building at the time), but I believe Nielk1 saw the same thing.

Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: TheJamsh on September 04, 2009, 12:59:20 PM
I changed all vehicles using 'tankfriend/enemy' to 'MorphTankFriend/Enemy' in my rec variant. It's just so much more aggressive. None of this messing around.

It looks like they are all too nervous that they might hit each other.

Fine-tuning tankFriend/Enemy will make them improve better. 1.3 added some subattack classes and attack tasks that don't seem to help to much. Tanks don't strafe as well as mortar bikes...

This is more Zero Angels area than anything, so long as hes up-to-date with the latest behaviour controls that are now ex-constants and ODF controlled.
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Red Devil on September 04, 2009, 09:29:21 PM
Add:

AttackTaskUsesGroups = false
GotoTaskHasLeader = false
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: TheJamsh on September 05, 2009, 02:45:01 AM
Yeh they help too. Theres loads of other adjustments though, you can make units quite different characters now in TA5, even fake loyalty to you to an extent (with the 'runaway!' flags)
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: mrtwosheds on September 05, 2009, 06:57:40 AM
Quoteeven fake loyalty to you to an extent (with the 'runaway!' flags)
Would you care to share your information source with us?
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: TheJamsh on September 06, 2009, 07:04:49 AM
from modlog. of course by 'runaway' i meant fleeing behaviour. You could just set this to 0 for something that never stops attacking, and 120 for something that runs away for two minutes before re-targetting:

AttackTaskAttackTimeout#
AttackTaskFleeTimeout#
AttackTaskStrafeAfterFlee#
AttackTaskStrafeToFleeTimeout#

OffensiveProcessIsDistractable
OffensiveProcessIsDistractableAITeam
OffensiveProcessIsTenacious
OffensiveProcessIsTenaciousAITeam

[ScavengerHClass]
IsFearless = true

Theres a ridiculous amount of exposed constants now... Modlog is my friend :D
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: mrtwosheds on September 06, 2009, 07:16:10 AM
Now I know what you are talking about. :-)
Title: Re: Sabre problems
Post by: Red Devil on September 06, 2009, 06:32:23 PM
I put all the exposed constants in those fast DM scouts a few years ago.