I was reading Avatar's prehistory, the part about the cthonians and became caught on a small sentence fragment: "dropping Biometal 'seeds' from orbit. "
I immediately thought of War of the Worlds and how, like in the prehistory, the seeds landed near towns and unleashed the terrible war machines which were near unstopable. It occurred to me that one could actually make a mod and perhaps change the history of battlezone with this idea? WHAT IF, the martian tripods really were bio-metal war machines that landed on Earth? Perhaps the British could have been the first to look at bio-metal and could have a secret lab somewhere. Just throwing it out there.
From what I understand, small traces of biometal are present in all Meteorite fragments that have reached the Earth's surface.
This actually means that until the Shower in the 1950's each nation would probably have small samples of biometal, but not NEARLY enough to do experiments to the extent done after it's "rediscovery" in the Bering Strait.
I do like where you are going with that though.
That's another big part of it, If the all the war machines were shut down when the organic material died from bacteria, the British would have massive amounts of it to conduct experiments with.
Do not be mistaken, biometal cannot "die". The machines only sleep. :evil:
Granted, but, the British could have melted it down, thinking it was regular steel, after which the "brain" of the bio-metal would be disoriented and be controllable by the British scientists. OR, in the far future, that bio-metal finally remembers its mission and sets out against earth.
I had a discussion with WF and came to an interesting idea. Cthonian relics existed on Earth, the Nexus in FE is proof of that. Even biometal pools exist though they are long sense sealed. There might have been, back in the time of BZ1, a group that gathered information and technology of this type. A sort of Torchwood for Battlezone.
Minus the bi-sexuals I hope...
Never saw Torchwood myself so... Taking place around the time of BZ1 I think bi-sexuals would be the least of our worries. Commies...
I always thought it would be cool to do a mod where, instead of America and Russia, Britain and Nazi Germany discover biometal first and fight out WW2 in space, with the RAF VS the Gestapo or something,
Sadly I am completely unable to make such a mod.
Lol I can just imagine the German pilots walk animation... :-D
Maybe if I got some people to help me...
Quote from: Nielk1 on November 14, 2009, 03:53:19 AM
A sort of Torchwood for Battlezone.
If that idea ever becomes a mod, please count me in.
Oh, what if during a routine petrol on mars, the EDF comes across a base of Martian bio-metal war machines. They could accidentally activate them and the walkers go fury on them, thus beginning a real war between Earth and Mars.
Considering the NSDF and CCA have been to Mars and found no Martians, would be safe to say the mechs would be Cthonian in origin or Fury... or we didn't look hard enough. :evil:
Allow me explain something: It is theorized that mars was once home to life but died as its core quickly[in geologic terms] expelled all its energy and thus the planet could not sustain life. When the giant planet[I like to think of it as Unicron] attacked Cthonia, it may have also sent probes to mars which sucked the life out of the planet, contrary to the theory, until the planet was dead. However, with their mothership destroyed around Cthonia[i think that's how it goes], They simply shut down and remained on mars until they re awakened, attacked Earth in War of the Worlds, lost, and went back to sleep.
Quoteor we didn't look hard enough.
Its quite possible, it is a pretty big planet.
It's Icarus, not Cthonia.
Sorry, but are you getting the picture here, I am going nuts over it.
Quote from: AHadley on November 14, 2009, 06:34:38 PM
It's Icarus, not Cthonia.
I prefer Cthonia, as does Avatar, but Icarus is the official name.
Quote from: Mr X on November 14, 2009, 08:29:37 AM
I always thought it would be cool to do a mod where, instead of America and Russia, Britain and Nazi Germany discover biometal first and fight out WW2 in space, with the RAF VS the Gestapo or something,
Sadly I am completely unable to make such a mod.
The Nazis did get biometal craft first. They just... died...
what a way to go, being blown out of the sky by a rocket after living on the moon for months.
Quote from: iron maiden on November 14, 2009, 07:02:52 PM
what a way to go, being blown out of the sky by a rocket after living on the moon for months.
http://www.bzcomplex.com/wiki/index.php?title=Reich
Strange, i read somewhere they tried launching an invasion of earth and landed in the arctic, and were then promptly destroyed.
Quote from: iron maiden on November 14, 2009, 07:06:40 PM
Strange, i read somewhere they tried launching an invasion of earth and landed in the arctic, and were then promptly destroyed.
Click the see also on the bottom of my link.
Note they likely never made it that far, though there are reports of the Prototype NSDF of the Truman Era fighting Nazis in space.
Personally once BZC comes out I would love to add some new BZ1 style races like some Germans with new stuff or my Pan Asian Space Coalition.
Of course its always possible that some of them escaped through a wormhole or time warp... :evil:
They would make excellent slaves for the Daleks!
Hey yeah, what if a few high ranking Nazis escaped and have been building up an automated army.
Its a good idea, but how long do you think those guys are gonna live?
They could use technology to lengthen their lives.
or they could have children and teach them in all their ways, leaving a massive automated army in the hands of their highly intelligent, not to mention heavily biased, offspring.
There is also the matter of food, water, disease, not being killed. :roll:
If you have a completely airtight environment, everything can be recycled,
Disease wouldbe less serious than on Earth, on average there would be less serious mutation in the limited bacteria,
And whats going to kill them in a base where everyone has the exact same views?
Quote from: Mr X on November 15, 2009, 08:35:39 PM
And whats going to kill them in a base where everyone has the exact same views?
'What is this? A star of David? Where did you get it. TELL ME WHERE!!!'
QuoteIf you have a completely airtight environment, everything can be recycled,
Disease wouldbe less serious than on Earth, on average there would be less serious mutation in the limited bacteria,
And whats going to kill them in a base where everyone has the exact same views?
1. There is a limit, especially for food.
2. Say they come across a new virus they have no immunity to.
3. Aliens, bacteria, comets, Radioactive waves, solar flares, the weather, shall i go on?
Or maybe they did a Braddock, and experimented on themselves with biometal, producing a different kind of "Master Race" rather than scions. Who knows how long they could live even without food?
Let me see, take one Gestapo Uniform, mix lightly with a spacesuit, add cyborg type textures scattered sparingly with Swastika's and Eagles. Liberally coat with numerous outrageous comical German Nazi wav files, animate with goose steps and stiff armed salutes... :-D
I would love to do this, but I don't think I will. It is a whole new mod.
Hell you could even throw in the Furer himself, having been frozen in a cryogenic chamber on the dark side of the moon since he faked his death and escaped at the end of the war and now returning as a huge cybernetic end boss.
You have a very active imagination sir, I like it! :-D :-D :-D :mrgreen:
Along with Stalin and Lenin
uh.......................what are you two talking about?
He suggested Hitler so I suggested Stalin and Lenin. Their similar.
Quote from: Clavin12 on November 17, 2009, 03:07:03 AM
He suggested Hitler so I suggested Stalin and Lenin. Their similar.
Do me a favor Clavin. READ A HISTORY BOOK.
Stalin and Lenin were both leaders of revolutions in Russia, afterwords becoming communist leaders. Hitler was a german dictator. They both had great power and in my opinion used it poorly. Thus they are similar.
Do you have any idea how ignorant that is?
Hitler = Dictator
Stalin / Lenin = Communist
Completely different things. In fact, they couldn't be further from each other. Dictatorship is far right-wing, communism is far-left. Democracy is in the middle, but most modern societies are democacies for less than a few hours every four years (depends on how often they vote).
I shouldn't have to educate you about this.
I'm saying their both at the far ends. And besides the leader of a communism is very much a dictator. Ever read Animal Farm?
...Communism is the perfect government.
Humans are just incapable of being communist because of one simple system hardwired into us. Greed. If we do not have more than our share, then if we run out we may find ourselves in danger. If we have more, then we are less likely to run out. It goes back to neolithic times.
I haven't read Animal Farm, but I do happen to have a basic, fundamental understanding of the many various governmental and political formats.
Actually, I'm farily sure its an accepted part of communism that at first you have a government based leadership in order to set it all up, when everything is in order said government disbands and everyone is completely equal. I'm sure I heard that somewhere.
The perfect government is that of a benevolent dictator.
By the people, for the people, democracy is the way to go!
Think about it. A benevolent dictator makes all the right choices, and is the fastest government ever.
Hitler...............good choices?
There is no such thing as a benevolent dictator, "Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely", words to live by.
There is such a thing. Most ppl just don't follow him.
And his name would be....................................?
Ugh I don't want to say this...God, Jehovah, Y'shua, Ala, and so on.
QuoteInsert Quote
Ugh I don't want to say this...God, Jehovah, Y'shua, Ala, and so on
Clavin, God is not a dictator, he is merely the creator from which all is born and returns to. You can believe in any spiritual deity you want, but i do not see the streets of Rome being flooded with parades with God speaking in German and saying to wipe out the other religions. God is not the dictator, he is the overseer.
Bear in mind that benevolent dictator is an oxymoron.
Dictator is defined as one with absolute power. Let me do a little editing "Power corrupts humans, and absolute power corrupts humans absolutely". Just because he is a dictator does not equate him with Hitler or any other human dictator. It does not mean he is corrupted. He isn't and he does rule those who will follow him. He gives us the choice.
But not everyone follows him, thus he cannot be the dictator of all humans. One must believe if one is to be controlled.
Quote from: iron maiden on November 17, 2009, 09:08:11 PM
By the people, for the people, democracy is the way to go!
No democracy in the world is truly a democracy. We are only democracies for four hours or so every four years, as I said. That's not much.
In a proper democract, every decision that needed to be made would have to be done via referendum.
Republic......Athens was king of the Greek city states.
Quote from: iron maiden on November 17, 2009, 09:31:20 PM
But not everyone follows him, thus he cannot be the dictator of all humans. One must believe if one is to be controlled.
Technically he is right now but isn't using that power. Non- technically, he will be a benevolent dictator at the end of the world.
I'm sorry Clavin, but I don't believe in God, and since there is no proof that he exists at all how can he be in charge?
Fine...I'll make you a bet. 50 bucks God exists. Get back to me at the end of the world.
And I will.................hold.....................................the money.
If you're using biology I'm using physics, try to keep up because this may be hard to follow,
Physics would have us believe that the universe is incredibly vast, and that there are unlimited parallel universes, and that time is infinite,
given all that space and time there are enough of those umpteen trillion to one chances occuring that they will probably occur somewhere,
now consider this, the implication here is that somewhere, intelligent life will develop, there are many potential forms for this intelligent life but it will take one of them. Wherever, whenever and however this intelligent life comes into being is inconsequential for this argument, it probably will. Also, it is because this intelligent life exists that it can question its existence, it percieves a very unlikely coincidence, but in fact it it is just the lucky one that happened.
In short, odds are life will occur somewhere, and it will at some point question the reason it exists.
edit: changing your post so I can't argue back? I don't think soQuote from: Clavin12 on November 17, 2009, 09:51:47 PM
Fine...I'll make you a bet. 50 bucks God exists. Get back to me at the end of the world.
Ok, kindly tell me when you think the world will end so that I can claim my winnings when you get it wrong.
And how do you know you have the right religion anyway? Surely if there was a God he wouldn't leave whether or not his ultimate creations are damned for all eternity up to chance.
Apparently in about three years, those Mayans were wicked smart! :roll:
How do you know physics are right?
That's the thing, nobody can prove either religion or physics right or wrong, that is why people fight constantly over it.
Theres more proof for physics compared to religion. (and by more I actually mean there is some proof)
Physics is a science, they have their opinions because the facts at hand all point in that direction. They are therefore far more likely to be right.
Religion is just something people in history made up because they couldn't explain anything. It has basis in fact only on the absolute minimum level.
If physics are correct then, how is it life can vary in so many way's? Would you like to face life knowing you do not go anywhere when you die? [Though granted it is better to go some places then others]
Hey Mr. X. Do you believe in wind?
Yes, whats your point?
Wind is caused by the Earth moving, historically religious people killed the scientists who suggested that the Earth wasn't stationary.
You know, if you stopped the rotation of the Earth, everything would be hit by a thousand mile an hour wind which, coupled with high heat, would kill much of the life on Earth.
Quote from: Mr X on November 17, 2009, 10:30:19 PM
Wind is caused by the Earth moving, historically religious people killed the scientists who suggested that the Earth wasn't stationary.
Wind doesnt make sense.That way the gravity moves.
........................what? Type clearly please.
Quote from: Mr X on November 17, 2009, 10:30:19 PM
Yes, whats your point?
Wind is caused by the Earth moving, historically religious people killed the scientists who suggested that the Earth wasn't stationary.
That statement goes against thousands of physics laws...
It is related to movement causing different distributions of sunlight and such, but it is not in any way caused by movement itself.
Quote from: iron maiden on November 17, 2009, 10:39:18 PM
You know, if you stopped the rotation of the Earth, everything would be hit by a thousand mile an hour wind which, coupled with high heat, would kill much of the life on Earth.
That is the very same reason rotation does not cause wind. The air is all moving at the same rate as the Earth itself.
Quote from: Clavin12 on November 17, 2009, 08:46:48 PM
The perfect government is that of a benevolent dictator.
The perfect government is socialist, but it can only be upheld once our technology reaches the point where money for necessities is no longer required. A Socialist system with a capitalist higher system is the best of all probabilities. It makes people get rewards for what they do above and beyond, but it still lets people share and work together for the necessities and lower levels. Look at Star Trek.
Ever read 1984? Epitome of socialism.
There are so many complex include heat,gravity,earthquake,polar magnetic field.Its what planet or sun spining.I feel polar magentic field from our sun did responsible to spining.If our sun was dead and no gravity or nothing at all,our solar system will stop spining and drift away each other.
Didn't know a solar system could spine.
Quote from: Clavin12 on November 17, 2009, 11:04:08 PM
Didn't know a solar system could spine.
Didn't know spine was a verb.
Previous leaders? check
Governments types and their moral and social implications? check
God's existence? check
God's non-existence? check
recap of David Hume? check
How wind is created? check...lol
Grammar Nazi's (pardon the pun) ? check
Back on topic? negatory
ill check back in a week :P
What was the topic again?
random ideas i suppose :D
I want to invent indestructible bubbles.
Get back to the original topic or this topic will be locked.
Well it was a random idea.
I personally like the BZ1 Torchwood bit.
It's a thread for random ideas, read the title :p
I think locking the topic is a bit excessive. bzuniverse has a knack for going OT. This is a trait I know and love, I was just poking fun at it.
If anything I think it should be iron maiden's call.
The problem is when religion and politics muck it up.
If we're going to avoid anything on this board, it's going to be BZ1vsBZ2, 1.2vs1.3, religion, and politics.
And just so you know, the Eurasian government in 1984 was Totalitarian, not Socialist.
Let's get back to random BZ ideas, though :P
Everything in moderation, except moderation, which should be used sparingly.
Random BZ2 idea: What if every weapon did damage to the firerer?
That would be annoying, frustrating, and extremely counterproductive. Maybe you could introduce something where if you fire it to fast in succession it heats up and hurts you so you have to be careful.
Quote from: Nielk1 on November 17, 2009, 10:41:20 PM
That statement goes against thousands of physics laws...
It is related to movement causing different distributions of sunlight and such, but it is not in any way caused by movement itself.
Wind is caused by the rising and falling of air according to its density changing as its temperature increases or decreases. It starts out equal to the rotation of the Earth, but as it rises or falls the distance of a full circle changes while its speed doesn't change straight away, therefore the air doesn't move at the same speed as the Earth is moving. Without the rotation of the Earth it would just be air moving up and down.
Quote from: Mr X on November 18, 2009, 06:16:23 PM
Wind is caused by the rising and falling of air according to its density changing as its temperature increases or decreases. It starts out equal to the rotation of the Earth, but as it rises or falls the distance of a full circle changes while its speed doesn't change straight away, therefore the air doesn't move at the same speed as the Earth is moving. Without the rotation of the Earth it would just be air moving up and down.
I'm afraid NK1 was right, it's nothing to do with rotation. You're right on pressure, temperature and density though. It's all to do with the ideal gas equation.
But back to BZ :P
Actually, at the end of the day the Earth has to be rotating for it to work.
Quote from: AHadley on November 18, 2009, 06:27:29 PM
But back to BZ
Oh all right :P
Quote from: Mr X on November 18, 2009, 06:16:23 PM
Without the rotation of the Earth it would just be air moving up and down.
Incorrect. Without the movement of all celestial bodies then the wind would not move.
Also, if the sun did revolve around the Earth we would have wind.
If the moon was orbiting to muckymuck with the tide we would have wind.
If the entire thing was static, we would still have wind because of uneven volcanic activity.
Wind comes from changes in air pressure which is from changes in temperature and humidity. It has very little to do with celestial bodies, except for the sun, which supplies changing temperatures. If the earth did not change position in respect to the sun, we would have very few changes in wind, or weather for that matter. Ocean currents that move temperatures would still cause a few changes in the weather (assuming the moon is still rotating to help keep the currents moving).
Going to share an idea that i have used in my mod already.
water/sea ripples and currents, you can generate waves or whatever sizes out at sea, by texturing and colouring the ground underneath it to the same as the water. Now granted this only works on shallow water and its not brilliant, but you can generate sound too. Obviously this relies on the siesmic class to work.
Im working on other ways to get this to work. BBB used an effect to draw his water in FS2, which again you may be able to use to your advantage with specialy shaped draw_geoms.
Its MUCH easier to do this on maps PURELY based on water. If you have land, it aint gunna look that good. You can make ships 'psuedo' interact with the water with carefully tuned LIFT_SPRING and LIFT_DAMP settings to make ships bounce. I do this on my surface skimmers to make them appear to be bouncing accross the water.
Did this make sense? doubt it... im in college and have a lack of brain power atm. Busy week.
Heres an idea. Sand dunes that are actually objects and explode in a burst of dust when you drive through them
TJ, at least it won't look much worse than Halo water.
Quote from: Clavin12 on November 19, 2009, 04:37:13 PM
Heres an idea. Sand dunes that are actually objects and explode in a burst of dust when you drive through them
FS2's reeds do that. Except they catch on fire.
Quote from: Clavin12 on November 19, 2009, 04:37:13 PM
Heres an idea. Sand dunes that are actually objects and explode in a burst of dust when you drive through them
Proxy mine, but you do NOT know how hard it would be to do this and get them to blend with terrain, and work seamlessly
Tripmine which creates a terrain object that reshapes the dune and causes dust effect.
Quote from: bigbadbogie on November 20, 2009, 08:26:57 AM
Tripmine which creates a terrain object that reshapes the dune and causes dust effect.
Better idea than mine actually. Although i dont think you can have effects on tripmines when they fire off can you? (Haven't tried before) Although i guess a limited life-span hardpoint effect on the terrain object would do it just fine.
ODF tunnels could make units drive over them too.
Here's another suggestion. I know water units have been explored before but here it is: you could make a unit that would start out in the water, you know with the altitude set to whatever to make it partly submerged, but then you'd give it no climbing ability, so it couldn't get out of the water.
Yeh but that doesnt work as well as you might think. The only two vehicle types capable of travelling underwater PROPERLY are APC and Artillery class. Both of which dont have enough flags to get working flawlessly. DLL really is the only way to do it totally.
How come hover ships can't?
They are incapable of passing below water. However, by reversing the setting for the E button so that it makes them travel downwards (something I have only seen Jamsh do before), they can be made to sink beneath it.
Hover units can now ignore water.
- Fix for mantis #1351. Exposed a few more constants, and added some
new items:
[HoverCraftClass]
OverLandVelocFrontMult = 1.0f;
OverLandVelocSideMult = 1.0f;
OverLandThrottleMult = 1.0f;
OverWaterVelocFrontMult = 0.75f;
OverWaterVelocSideMult = 0.75f;
OverWaterThrottleMult = 0.8f;
AirborneVelocFrontMult = 1.0f;
AirborneVelocSideMult = 1.0f;
AirborneThrottleMult = 1.0f;
AirborneMinHeightRatio = 2.0f;
AirborneMaxHeightRatio = 5.0f;
DeployedOverLandVelocFrontMult = 1.0f;
DeployedOverLandVelocSideMult = 1.0f;
DeployedOverLandThrottleMult = 1.0f;
DeployedOverWaterVelocFrontMult = 0.75f;
DeployedOverWaterVelocSideMult = 0.75f;
DeployedOverWaterThrottleMult = 0.8f;
DeployedAirborneVelocFrontMult = 1.0f;
DeployedAirborneVelocSideMult = 1.0f;
DeployedAirborneThrottleMult = 1.0f;
DeployedAirborneMinHeightRatio = 2.0f;
DeployedAirborneMaxHeightRatio = 5.0f;
UseWaterHeight = true
DeployedUseWaterHeight = true
Lots of options. This allows users to specify how hovercraft handle
over water, and airborne. The 'FrontMult' values are a multiplier on
velocForward/velocReverse, and SideMult is a multiplier on
velocStrafe. The Airborne min/max heightratio is used to blend
between land/water and the airborne values. A craft's heightratio is
the current altitude (above land/water) divided by
[HoverCraftClass]::setAltitude, so that if it's at setAltitude,
heightRatio is 1.0. If it's twice setAltitude, heightRatio is 2.0.
Heightratio values less than the MinHeightRatio will use the
land/water setting. Values over MaxHeightRatio will use the airborne
setting. If it's between min & max, it linearly interpolates between
the settings. UseWaterHeight is a way to use the water when
calculating heights to be at. [NM]
Also, see these:
- Fix for mantis #1348, 1332, and some things I thought might be
useful to modders. Added in some DLL callbacks:
DLLEXPORT bool DLLAPI TerrainIsWater(const Vector &pos);
DLLEXPORT bool DLLAPI TerrainIsWater(float x, float z);
DLLEXPORT bool DLLAPI TerrainGetHeightAndNormal(const Vector& pos, float& outHeight, Vector& outNormal, bool useWater);
DLLEXPORT bool DLLAPI GetOutputPath(size_t& bufSize, wchar_t* pData);
DLLEXPORT bool DLLAPI GetPathPoints(Name path, size_t& bufSize, float* pData);
DLLEXPORT Handle DLLAPI GetOwner(Handle h);
DLLEXPORT void DLLAPI SetTarget(Handle obj, Handle target);
DLLEXPORT void DLLAPI SetOwner(Handle obj, Handle target);
See comments above them in scriptutils.h. Bug me if I forgot to
upload a latest DLL source distribution w/ scriptutils.h. Note: can't
guarantee that mines/torpedos/etc have the owner set as expected. [NM]
In combination with a hovercraft that ignores water from above, DLL can now detect the water height and make a perfect submarine. A unit that is an aircraft below water, and an immobile water ignoring hovercraft above (with all velocity and angle passed into it).
How on Earth did my original idea come to this?
QuoteWhat was the topic again?
Quoterandom ideas i suppose
No, SBT, this thread was made to post an idea i had, read the first post:
QuoteI was reading Avatar's prehistory, the part about the cthonians and became caught on a small sentence fragment: "dropping Biometal 'seeds' from orbit. "
I immediately thought of War of the Worlds and how, like in the prehistory, the seeds landed near towns and unleashed the terrible war machines which were near unstopable. It occurred to me that one could actually make a mod and perhaps change the history of battlezone with this idea? WHAT IF, the martian tripods really were bio-metal war machines that landed on Earth? Perhaps the British could have been the first to look at bio-metal and could have a secret lab somewhere. Just throwing it out there.
Yeah, but the thread title is more important than the first post.
the DLL stuff looks very interesting.
My method was similar to timevirus', use an APC so that it ignores the grounds angle, and travels straight at all time. The only issue with this, is that they will travel through and underneath the terrain (well, only because ive set them up to work on everymap). DLL could intercept this though.
Im using artillery now, as that way you travel to locations on the surface, then submerge to fire weapons. Would probably be better the other way around though. Submarines are still hard to get working properly but it is easier now. At least my subs stop dead when they do hit land (thanks to flags pointed out there by N1).
Maybe we could use them in a couple single missions, specialized to include them.