File Link Remove: Closing Experiment Recycler Variant for now...
Some People reporting that the hover units are either slugish or need to be balanced. With the help of the Battlezone Community we would like to experiment with changing the balance for the hover units.
In this Experiment we jhave changed 3 values that DeadScion
Recommend: velocStrafe, accelThrust, acceljump
We would like FeedBack from everyone & if your afraid of your post getting edited or removed please feel free to send a PM to GreenHeart so that
those who are doing the Tweaks can hear what asset tweaks we need to make. Even though Hovering was a bug & won't be changed by the Developers. We can still try to do some asset tweaks to balance things out so that they are somewhat better for us all.
Edit: Added Experiment Recycler Variant to MPI Recycler Listing....
That file should be unzipped to the BZ2 1.3 root and is compatible with stock 1.3? No seperate installation required, and everything else is the same?
I dont understand why a recycler is needed. Why not have a map simply spawn some of your ships? Testing is time consuming enough with having to set up a base too.
Quote from: aougliThat file should be unzipped to the BZ2 1.3 root and is compatible with stock 1.3? No seperate installation required, and everything else is the same?
No seperate installation required, this shouldn't cause bad assets..
LOL, that certainly was good timing, GreenHeart! Love it.
See guys?
Downloading now.
thanks for the reply.
Something else I should have asked: does everyone in the session need that zip file or just the server?
The way it works, you select the recycler variant and any person who does not have that file will be unable to join the game as the game will recognize they don't have important files and will disable the enter game button on their screen.
Quote from: TimeVirusI dont understand why a recycler is needed. Why not have a map simply spawn some of your ships? Testing is time consuming enough with having to set up a base too.
Did nobody see this?
:)
This is the perfect idea for initial 'feel of it' testing, as the map could be built to concentrate on the aspects being tested. A few ramps, some cliffs, a race course maybe, with respawning ships and an arena for dogfighting...
Make it a DM map so people can come and go when they want, grab a ship and take a quick spin.
-Av-
Sure I saw that. But I can unzip a file, though not make a map, especially with fancy settings. :D
Just use ST:Mars and put some spawns there. Lots of terrain to use to your advantage there.
I've got a Quarry map going now with the test Scout. I like how they feel. Of course you can't hover in it, but it feels good. I've tried the default and the one built by the Rec.
my first test was great, I think this is one the right track.
Strafing and jumps are pretty close. Forward motion is still a little stiff.
I think if accelthrust, top speed were increase just a hair more this will do nicely atleast in the ISDF scouts.
Also pitchtrust increased .01 more would give it a better feel.
I am curious to know what others have to say, I am only one player.
Were any other vehicles changed?
I liked it, but needs some serious strat testing to see if its warpy in that environment.
I thought it was better than stock 1.3. Forgot to test reverse (http://www.the-rip.com/wbboard/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif).
This was with GamePrefs at default.
DeadScion I changed the Sabre, the ISDF Scout, and the missile scout by applying the changes you requested. I also applied those same changes to the scion scout and the scion sentry.
Does everyone else think the scout should be a little faster? If so, how much sounds good? I'll update the odfs then I'll send them to GreenHeart so they can be uploaded.
Seeing as this is experimental, how about the scouts have as much speed as possible without messing up the game/network performance? And the other hover craft have proportionate increases too?
I can do sommersaults in a morphed Scout, so maybe it is okay now?
Been hearing complaints in-game about more warping, so maybe the velsmooth/maxsmooth settings will have to be adjusted too in their gameprefs.
THAT SCOUT IS AWESOME!!! I think that's the answer!
If that's the scout that will be in final 1.3, then I'm there! Love it! :)
(ps. I agree on some multiplayer testing to see warp, because I believe that scout is a tiny amount faster than the 1.2 one)
I'm glad you liked it. Here are the lines I changed. I added the original speed after the // for reference. This was taken from the odf files you all received.
velocStrafe = 30.0 // changed from 20 [20]
accelThrust = 35.0 // changed from 25 acceleration [25.]
accelJump = 21.0 // changed from 18
I increased velocStrafe 10 units, I increased accelThrust 10 units, and I increased accelJump 3 units as requested by DeadScion.
LOL appel! See? No problems, just more opportunity to come up with a cool solution.
I think everybody who got upset owes Nathan an apology and Commando, GreenHeart, and DeadScion a big Thank You.
Now lets all go shoot at each other like proper gentlemen.
I have one question: Why does the experiment Variant only show up when I choose a strat map?
I like MPI stuff.
GH or Commando will have to edit the mpi recy list so you can see the variant there.
I only added the recycler to strat since the strat players were the most vocal about it. To add it to mpi, copy and rename the copy of recylist.txt to RecyListMPI.txt.
[Deleted because I just saw Commando's post above.]
Warp of scouts side-to-side is more extreme with these initial settings,
gameprefs at default, host set mwf 5.
I expect it to be better on lower mwf.
ADDED: Experimental Recycler to MPI Recycler List (See First Post in this Thread).
This was Request by some Testers wanting to use the Experimental Recycler in the mpi...
Hahaha! Hover is back!
You can hover scouts again! The reverse thrust isn't very strong so you have to use a bit of sideways thrust in it, essentially making the hover harder just a bit. But! Its still possible to constant hover, and gain altitude in the air. Exactly like 1.2. Those scouts are so agile and jumpy that they surpass 1.2 by tenfold.
I know 1.2 vets will love this. This is what I expect. 1.3 will come stock with *no hover* more-agile scouts. Basically a dumbed-down version of this. Next, modders will make 2 more recs:
- Full Hover Rec
- Half Hover Rec
They will be added to the list much like in this experiment. That way it makes a shell option for several levels of hover, to satisfy 1.2ers. A full hover would be like it is now, maybe a bit easier though. A half hover would allow hover to some extent. The normal recs will allow no hover. Now the server has the choice for hovering or not!
See how things turn out! There is no point to 1.2 anymore with this. It satisfies EVERYONE!
Note: There is a thread out there to post your opinions on this topic. I'd say to keep this thread for issues pertaining to the agility of the scout.
Yup. Dunno if it is fully persistant hovering (maybe it is), but it is enough to take out a turret or two, maybe a power or two. Saw this done in an ISDF scout and in a Mortar bike. Possible to gain altitude in an MB. I can't hover in a 1.3 patched scout, easier in a MB. Someone was complaining that MBs were untouchable even with Blast (difficult to get the angle to point vertically up?).
So, the good news is, flying units are like 1.2. The bad news is, flying units are like 1.2. :s
I've been testing this scout very strictly in 1.3, vs. turrets, gt's, enemy scouts with chain, laser and enemy tanks with sp+laser and blast+chain combo. For about 1 and a half our.
Thanks to strange<fly>, Aegeis, Z and Bri I've reached a conclusion about some final tuning needed for the tanks and scouts so the balance in the game is preserved:
1. Scout speed needs to be tuned down by 10-15%
They are too fast, both in air, running away, on the ground and especially fighting tanks. If anything they will cause more havoc then the current 1.2 scouts.
2. Tanks need 10-15% more agility and speed
In my opinion 1 good tank pilot should be able to kill 2 good scout pilots. Currently the balance with the 1.3 tank and the new 1.3 scout is totally reversed. 1 good scout pilot can kill 2 good tank pilots, or at least 1 good tank pilot. The scout moves too quick for the sluggish tank to keep up.
This needs to be balanced better since already in 1.2 we have people cursing that 1 scout can kill a tank easily (sometimes).
I must admit, very good work, they are just as awful as that bug in 1.2 :D
This is precicelsy the kind of testing that should have occured long ago.
I have never been a great fan of "full Hover games"..I have liked the "No Base Area Hover " games that are least 50% of 1.2 games.
Of course a shell option would satisfy everyone.
1 suggestion, shy away from 3 or 4 "rec variants" for this, there is already some "argueing" over game settings in the shell....Options are great, but not at the price of being a bigger fight than the Battle.
I'd also like to see a tweak, that prevents the UPWARD movement of scouts. I can see where the physics achieve a Static hover,and the scouts do not sink...But to make a acsending nose down scout is still a bit ridiculous.
As far as changes to the Sabres/Warriors...No way a Sabre should hover in any way shape or form.
ALSO..Once a "working" and universally acceptable scout is agreed upon, wider testing to determines its balance in real game situations is needed.
Already I've seen mentions of the warp attributed to the "new scout"..this is just the tip of the icebeg...You also have to factor in Scion Scouts and Drones. And he "bettter" physics should not create a "Super Scout" that is superior to tanks..etc etc...
I noticed the link has been removed. I hope it's because you're working on a new release? :?
If not I have a release ready for screwing with.
I believe the link was removed because GSH was pretty upset about flying being back in, even in the form of a 'server options' mod.
Don't expect it to stay possible in the final version of 1.3 that comes out.
Does this mean we have to wait [months/a large portion of the year] for the next *beta*?
Quote from: BZ FeebleEffortThis is precicelsy the kind of testing that should have occured long ago.
<snippage>
Already I've seen mentions of the warp attributed to the "new scout"..this is just the tip of the icebeg...You also have to factor in Scion Scouts and Drones. And he "bettter" physics should not create a "Super Scout" that is superior to tanks..etc etc...
Welcome back... hehe
:D :D :D :D :D
The warp could be the speed exceeding the smoothing/prediction code. Keep it real folks... :lol:
-Av-
You can increase the smoothening code if the scout is too fast. Remember there is the maxsmooth command in the console and the gameprefs file.
Quote from: DarkFoxI believe the link was removed because GSH was pretty upset about flying being back in, even in the form of a 'server options' mod.
Don't expect it to stay possible in the final version of 1.3 that comes out.
Will he adjust the code to stop the hovering scouts? That could be possible.
Note: I suggested this because it was for the better of the community in a whole. Personally, I don't care for hover. I can have a fun game either way. Bz2 is the best game whether the bug is in or not.
I highly doubt GSH would touch the physics code, it is not his area and it already works, he wants to fix more things, not possibly break something else, he does not care how you mod it up, all modding does is increase the longevity. People should stop being so paranoid, there is no reason to be.
The question remains if the infinite-flying bug cure in the core code has done anything it's supposed to do, even with these new 1.2-compatible odf re-tweaks being done. Or maybe it got broken somewhere along the way and no one noticed. Even then, I don't think hover will get nowhere as near as it "exactly" was in 1.2 with odf tweaking alone, whether or not people want it back exactly or some balance inbetween.
My viewpoint was based on a chat with wz, GSH, smokedog, and a couple of other non-private-beta players in the public lobby the other night. GSH made it pretty clear that it was going to be removed somehow. His response to finding out that flying was back in with this recycler mod, as a direct quote, was 'Flying is a bug, squashing it will be fun'.
Nathan also spoke a little about the current anti-flying solution, which he referred to as 'solution A', to hovering. Seeing that it had not worked, he spoke of coding 'solution B' into the next *private* beta release.
Since this conversation was held on an open IRC channel with plenty of witnesses, I can't see any reason it wouldn't be ok to mention it here, so I'm just spreading the word. Please delete this post if this information was something that wasn't supposed to get out.
My viewpoint? I hate hovering, but I view the current setup with the option as the best solution for all parties. That being said, the only reason I'd be displeased at the removal of the current setup is if it fractures the community, which it may well do.
I believe GSH will try to prevent this in further releases.
"GSH will go back and limit ODF settings or some other nonsense which will kill hover permanently in the next version he creates." - Author: <will not give any names>
Edited for the sake of calming down...for now...
I think speculation at this point is a bad thing , we don't know what will happen yet , lets wait and see before making further comments guys , I would hate to see a repeat of the initial flame threads that occured straight after 1.3's release , especially when no-one knows for certain yet what will happen .
Quote from: appelThanks to strange<fly>, Aegeis, Z and Bri I've reached a conclusion about some final tuning needed for the tanks and scouts so the balance in the game is preserved:
wheres me, fried, opp and pod? :P :D
But, it is a solution for both parties, hosts can set hovering on/off in a matter of speaking, so what's the big deal with it?
If its a bug wich will be fun squashing wait till you see its friends :evil: !
Bugs have existed since life began, and bugs will exist long after the human has perished. :)
The simple fix which I see happening is that side thrusters will have effectiveness falloff like the forward and reverse. AKA you ain't staying in the air forever bub, but at the same time you can make ship move as fast and agile as you want it two on the ground.
I like it and i think it's a great idea , it was nice to have some big air dogfights in 1.3 and having it as a server option i really cant see what the problem is.
I asked on several occasions if it was possible to make a new unit that could hover or fly like a 1.2 scout in 1.3 after the bug was squashed, seems it is.
If as stated the original bug in 1.2 that allowed hover was squashed then surely this "server" option should stay.
I'd just like to see their engines overheat from the strain and blow up.
"Look! I'm hoverBOOM!" That'd cure it real fast. :D
Yeh sure it'd cure it, and bz2 would become another run of the mill boring game and many would either play 1.2 or the 1.3 that is out now or indeed something new.
I like the guys i play strats against, we have some serious fun, we do not base rush or base hover but we do have some crazy loop the loop insane dogfights that are just impossible to do in stock 1.3, now i also know many others also play in this style as they have been doing so for over 5 years now.
Not everyone likes to have a 3 hr mpi fighting against a predictable ai team. Though i must admit that i do on occasion when nobody else is available for me to try to outfox.
I don't see why people aren't taking the "Anti-Hovering" code as a challange. BZ2 despite being a fiction came is based on its own rules. Inf Hovering was breaking the law of gravity which is a bug. Now that doesn't ruin your fun at all imo. In dog fights using gravity to your advantage can create fun tatics. Why not try this before saying "I want my hover back".
Sonic, the flying was not breaking the law of gravity one bit. You don't know a single thing about physics, and you have just proved it.
what the HELL is wrong with hovering??!?
no1 so far gave a good reason!!
its a bug?
well its fun!! and TONS of games has bugs that are beeing kept because they support the cause of the game, to have fun
game is made to hf.. not to be realstic and not to be perfact!
so stop thinking all realstic and perfact and bugs and start thinking about what will be fun!!
i do not find ANY way hovering killing the fun because if u just improve the defense that ppl wont be able to hover kill bases like its being done in 1.2 then np...
hovering is fun for those who know how to do it. hovering is not fun for those who doesnt know how because 1. it killed their bases (i said the soultion...)
and 2. because they are getting owned in fights by it? (maybe that?)
well 2 bad.. go in ET with eliets and get 3 headshots and get owned, learn to do it yourself and learn to counter... then every1 will hf instead of taking the fun of those who spent time and power to do this and who will be happy if u take it away? no1... it'll go back before it strated and no1 thought about it so no "boost" to fun like what hover brings
hover = fun
game is made for fun
Quote from: MowerManSonic, the flying was not breaking the law of gravity one bit. You don't know a single thing about physics, and you have just proved it.
Inf Hovering was breaking the law of gravity when assuming commen sense of the technology the game went. The hover Tanks/Scouts and so forth used a force to push them self off the ground to a certain point like 5m or so. When the tank is in the air it no longer has something to push off of thus gravity should take effect. The thrusters on the tank (strafe, reverse, foward) are not powerful enough to hold a tank in the air inf time. If they were, your jump thrusters could take you out of orbit! It could slow the decent but NOT hold it there forever. This is the generall commen sense that was build around the game.
Tell you what. The day one of these (http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/lcac_1997-3.jpg) does a nose down hover with no support of any kind, I'll join your cause. Until then I like 1.3 the way it is.
put it on the moon and it probably can
Sorry to get all physics again, but I'm afraid one of those won't be able to nose down hover on the moon - seeing as the moon has no gas particles to provide a reaction force on the craft's rotating blades. A hovercraft won't work in a vacuum environment like the moon.
Quote from: RisaIt is a solution for both parties, hosts can set hovering on/off in a matter of speaking, so what's the big deal with it?
If its a bug wich will be fun squashing wait till you see its friends :evil: !
...
What is the problem? Frankly, when I usually play a game like this, I dont give a wooden nickel about what the creators of the game think about bugs in the game, I care about the gaming experiance... Some people want none-hover, some want with hover, and seeing it is now possible to set hover on/off everyone is happy right? So whats the problem? Who cares if GSH likes it? The gamers like it, thats what making a game is all about (unless it has a deeper meaning, read my thread)..
Quote from: Risaquote from Nathans web site:
"A special note: one of the bugs fixed is the infinite flying bug present in BZ2 1.0 - 1.2. This was removed because it is considered to be a bug by those of us who worked on BZ2 from the beginning. It is not due to complaints from "newbies" or the like. Certain people certainly feel strongly about this. Fine. Your feelings are not an argument. Whining about this will not change anything-- we've heard such complaints for years, and your comments will only serve to harden our resolve in this. If you still think you must comment, see here."
I was just wondering, has bz2 a special meaning, is it supposed to give a message out to the world? Or is it a 'work of my life', that everything has to be perfect?
I get the feeling that the people who worked on the patch cared too much about the original intention (deeper meanings?) of the game, rather than caring about the gaming experiance..
(...)
Is this (bz2) about the fun of the (hardcore) players, or the fun of people who play far less/not??
you tell me
Quote from: AvatarSome parts of the game are a certain way to give the game it's 'flavor'. 'Infinite Hovering' was never an intended use of the Tanks. Mods can give you it back (pretty much) if it's something you absolutely can't live without, but it's not part of the basics of the game and never was intended to be...
Mods can give it back, well, isn't that JUST what the new rec is? Its a modifcication of the 1.3 rec, and it puts hovering back in, its a MOD, I dont see no problem with it
Quote from: MowerMan
At least flying didn't render many units useless like skiing did in Tribes, but the Tribes devs didn't want to remove something that was never intended, because the community liked it.
At least here the devs listen to players
Quote from: RisaPoint is, who is this game made for? Gamers probably! And, if gamers would like to have something, wich (with the experimental rec) can be turned on/off by server, whats the big deal? Its about the gaming, it's not supposed to bring a message to the outer world, so it doesn't have to be perfect (thats my opinion)
I mean if you dotn want to hover, use a default 1.3 rec, if you do, use the new one, its all about the gamers, don't think many people will come into this game, its too old for that, so I would try to keep the current group in (or am I missing something here?)
But maybe some people would just want a certain group of gamers to find another game or something? It doesnt have to be 'my way or the highway'!
^ = my opinion
(original thread found here (http://bzuniverse.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1655).)
thanks for your time
I don't understand why people want realism in BZ2's highly imaginative world. Still, hopefully some 40 year old technology with a proven track record can demonstrate the realism of near supersonic aircraft that can hover and shoot other aircraft and stuff on the ground.
"The combined "thrusts" enable the Harrier to either hover or fly normally depending on the position of the nozzles which can be rotated in unison along the longitudinal axis anywhere from straight aft for forward flight to a little forward of straight down for hover. Nozzle positions are controlled by a single lever near the throttle. To control the aircraft in the hover mode and thus going too slowly for normal flap, elevator and rudder surfaces to be operable, a reaction control system cuts in which enables high pressure bleed air to be routed to exhaust ducts at the wing tips, nose and tail called "puffers" or "puff pipes".
When the pilot moves the stick forward, the puffer under the tail emits air causing the nose to go down; and when he pulls it back, the puffer under the nose emits air causing the nose to go up. Similarly, side-to-side movement of the stick operates the puffers at the wing tips (inversely of course) causing the plane to roll; and puffers at the tail operated by the rudder pedals, blow air sideways to control "yaw". As far as the pilot is concerned, the controls continue to operate normally."
(http://aougli.the-rip.com/other/small-harrier4.jpeg)
doing its hover thing (http://aougli.the-rip.com/other/Harrier.mpeg) 543KB mpeg (use: right click -> save target as)
Operational behaviour (http://broadcast.illuminatedtech.com/display/story.cfm?bp=98&sid=8012)
technical graphical analysis of vortices (http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Groups/VisTech/other/topology/Pictures/pictures.html)
Pilot's testimony about low level flying and hovering (http://www.af.mil/news/airman/0297/hang.htm)
In my view, this real world evidence does not provide any force either way as to how flying vehicles should behave in BZ2, but it might be of interest to those with an interest in some realism in BZ2.
These bz2 vehicles are not of the modern age, thus cannot be explained by it.. 200 years ago, did they think they would go into outer space, or have supersonic aircraft, or explore the deepest oceans in super subs?
We cannot predict what future vehicles will do...
Furthermore I'd like to bring up this thread (http://loc-serv.net/cgi-bin/c/ikonboard.cgi?s=5707085bf8f60548b0afed41618bb738;act=ST;f=58;t=74;st=0;r=1;&#entry4) as it holds perfect arguments (dont know if its still up on these forums)
Seems ppl have fogotten the BZ timeline :roll:
Scout, I'm not going to explain how fields work again, and the obvious field we are talking about here is gravity. In other words Sonic, the hover effect is working against gravity, which does not drop off for thousands of meters for objects of planetary mass.
Agouli is correct it's silly to point to atmospheric craft and expect them to predict BZ2 craft dynamics. BZ2 craft operate independant of atmospheres (the craft also normalize the local gravitation to earth-mass, so every planet's gravity feels the same).
MowerMan, despite what theories we could cook up on how hover works, the developers of the game are the ones that determin the "Laws" of the game. In this case inf hovering is a bug and it is NOT going to be allowed to be added by a mod or Recy Varient.
You are like talking to a brick, Sonic!
If I recall, you were the same way back in the Smart Service Truck Discussion.
Risa: regarding the link to the thread on the loc board:
10*Gauge is just too stupid to find his own posts. We never deleted any of them.
EDIT: here the link to it:
http://bzuniverse.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1593&start=100
scroll down a bit.
we never said u delted it.. i just think pyro (risa) havnt saw it... i wanted to tell him no need to put the loc link because it is alreadyt on this boards
Indeed Sonic you bring up another fine example of how it is impossible for you to understand science, engineering, or logic.
didn't say it wasnt here, just didn't wanna look for it Fish :P
Thanks for clearing that up. I am sick and tired of people accusing me of deleting posts. :beerchug:
well u may note that as is there are still more 1.2 games being played than 1.3 even with the hover reccy as is.
Fair chance that if the hover reccy is removed then even less 1.3 games will be online.
with some of the awesome new mods being developed for 1.3 , players will be missing out on a helluva a lot more than hovering if they stick to 1.2 .
I should imagine people will still have a 1.3 installed lizard and play the mods that will be released
but as for the strat community you know even now as is, the fe strat player group is small compared to the 1.2 strat player group (FE being the mod)
Personally i like 1.3 mpi's though i normally play these alone.
To dogfight combat etc i like 1.2 physics it's a real buzz and the buzz that has kept me playing bz2 when 2-3 years ago i became bored with g66 ,modai mpi's ,instants and SP.
So, 1 more year until final 1.3 is released and then another 6 months for the mods to be developed? Not being too unrealistic am I? So, in 2006 we can expect 1.3 to be as popular as 1.2? :o
I thing fixing the strafe thrusters while in air will cause more harm than good to be honest. Fixing it so it wouldn't cut out when your ship is level would be difficult to do. If the thrusters are cut out period, you'll be a sitting duck while in the air.
I like the current physics since they remind me of Battlezone's physics.
Leaving in the thruster bug may be a good idea. That way modders could mod flying units. That way the vets can play their own 1.3 mod, if they choose to play 1.3 at all, and others could play with the official recyclers. Currently the physics are pretty much fixed for stock ships. The only problematic ship is the mortar bike.
Quote from: appelSo, 1 more year until final 1.3 is released and then another 6 months for the mods to be developed? Not being too unrealistic am I? So, in 2006 we can expect 1.3 to be as popular as 1.2? :o
Provided GSH and Ken haven't said "screw them" and decided to take off and leave us with what we have now. I personally wouldn't hold it against them if they did. All that FREE hard work only to get spit in the face. PPL have to remember that this is only a beta and not final but there were more than a few that came in here with an attitude about how the vehicles handled forgetting that it is JUST A BETA and that things are NOT FINALIZED.
QuoteI thing fixing the strafe thrusters while in air will cause more harm than good to be honest. Fixing it so it wouldn't cut out when your ship is level would be difficult to do. If the thrusters are cut out period, you'll be a sitting duck while in the air.
I agree! I like how in 1.2, you could arc over a target, then cut a hard left and suddenly be at his side.
It would be nice if the vehicles were heavier, but the jump thrusters still slowed descent to the point that it is now. Might add a bit to maneuverability to be able to better control your fall rate; but i'd imagine that would open up a whole new can 'o worms.
Good Post, BZZ. Concise. 8)
Quote from: appelSo, 1 more year until final 1.3 is released and then another 6 months for the mods to be developed? Not being too unrealistic am I? So, in 2006 we can expect 1.3 to be as popular as 1.2? :o
AHAHAH!
So in 2006 we can expect to see 2 or 3 game of 1.3 in peak times!
There is only a maximum of 20 to 30 players playing bz2 everydays, they are also the same people working to fix the bugs and make a mod of 1.3 wich everyone would play.
But they are also the players, devs are saying to "Screw what you think we make the game as we want it!"
I'm glad we have devs working on a new patch on their own free time. But im also very disapointed to see they want to make the game as they see it and not as the players want it. If devs would have spent half the time they've put in the 1.3 patch and played with us some 1.2, im sure the patch would be out already and everyone would be happy.
Turrets would shoot straight up, hovering would be a hard skill to master and also infinite flying impossible, speed bug would be fix. All av and crash bugs would be fix, some tweak on ai done so we can use them against human. Some more server setting like those in 1.3 already ( mwf, starting units, etc) and none the less some balance issue between scions and isdf fixed.
Quote from: PhaserBut they are also the players, devs are saying to "Screw what you think we make the game as we want it!"
...
Turrets would shoot straight up, hovering would be a hard skill to master and also infinite flying impossible, speed bug would be fix. All av and crash bugs would be fix, some tweak on ai done so we can use them against human. Some more server setting like those in 1.3 already ( mwf, starting units, etc) and none the less some balance issue between scions and isdf fixed.
#1 if that where the case every weapon would be a rave cannon :o The only thing that the devs are unwaivering on is that infinit hovering is a bug. They dont care about unit speeds, game balance and such, in fact they have said what ever people can agree on in in terms of balance is good by them.
#2 For the last part the only thing that 1.3 does not have are turrets that can shoot straight up. But that is a simple odf tweak that can be tested with the new recy option. The balance between scions and isdf is another area that this public patch is supposed to address. So if you have any suggest for that please post them.
Lol rave canon everywhere, the starfleet dream i guess!
No im talking about the variable recyclers here wich if i believe the quote from gsh a fix will be made to stop modder to include that particular feature that is hovering. Im not an hoverer, i never hovered and never seen the utility of it. Altho i pefectly know that if i couldnt straffe turrets and gts i would have to hover to be effective with a scout.
Scouts are the primary vehicle and also the last ressort vehicles in this game. When you are stroke with 1 pool and the opponent is hanging in tanks, all you can afford are scouts and chains/pummels. Now if the game make it impossible to win with 3 scout only, thats taking out a whole chalenge to both teams.
So to keep it real the opinions of people playing 6hours+/days is needed and they are those im talking about. None of them want to see rave guns in this game and stuff like that. Their concern is about their addiction, their drug wich is battlezone 2.
Regarding balance issue between both races, well i could go ahead and speak my theories about how both races build bases, their diferences, strenght and weakness but i dont feel like it. The major issue between both races always been blink, there is nothing in strat to counter blink ships. They can blink into your base to finish you off and blink away before they get harmed by your defences, they can get away each time you about to kill them and they can assault without been hit before landing first munition into your building.
There is already a counter to blink in bz2 but not allowed in strat, it is force shield. That may bring a whole discussion about balance isdf vs isdf but i may tell you its not such an issue since its taking a lot of your ammo to use the shield. And taking out camera from special menu in armory wouldnt be a big deal, i mean who use it anyway?
It's easy enough to add a new armoury menu slot, u dont have to lose anything. Should test it out maybe.
i know its easy tho scion will have only 3 special while isdf 4, if i recall right every armory menu are even in slot for both race.