Are there any programs that can open up an xsi for the sole purpose of moving HPs around? I have a few models I want to fix, but I haven't found anything that will do the job. Please don't say Threed because that program is trash for two reasons, it only saves 10% of the model I want to save, and it screws up my mouse settings when opened forcing me to restart my pc.
I'm hoping Overmind is willing to tweak the MSH viewer by adding the ability to manipulate XSIs but I don't see that happening.
What type of model is it?
I have become quite good at moving hp_s around in notepad.
Hover assault tank.
Basically it's ivhtank00.xsi in patch13.pak. If you look at it in 3dEX, you can see the hp_eyepoint is placed way too high.
My goal was to readd the original eyepoint from ivtank00.xsi, rename that hardpoint hp_temp, move the problematic hp_eyepoint to it perfectly overlaps hp_temp then delete hp_temp.
Unfortunately doing so in threed corrupts the model. Granted I would only use threed for the coordinates since I don't trust threed.
I plan on doing the same for both light hardpoints, for the same model.
In notepad anyway, just look for the frametransformationmatrix or whatever it was called of the HP you wish to move, the numbers are like this:
qr_0 qr_1 qr_2 qr_3
qp_0 qp_1 qp_2 qp_3
qy_0 qy_1 qy_2 qy_3
x y z w
If you want it to face forward then all the Q's must be like this:
1 0 0 0
0 1 0 0
0 0 1 0
x y z w
The w should generally always be 1 as well, especially if facing forward and unscaled.
The x, y, and z are the xyz coords, alter them to where you need it as you please.
As for an editor, my viewer has no xsi importing capabilities, only writing. Would be easier to make a new one, but I do not really have any time...
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it's ivhtank00.msh.
You have the xsi.
Open both of them in notepad, find the eyepoint frame
This is an example
Frame frm-hp_eyepoint {
FrameTransformMatrix {
1,0,0,0,
0,1,0,0,
0,0,1,0,
0,0,0.761905,1;;
copy this line 0,0,0.761905,1;;
from one to the other and save.
I know how to edit the object in notepad, that isn't the problem. The problem is I can only get an approximate location using notepad. With a GUI based editor, I can get a lot more precise placement which is what I'm trying to get.
Because of the hierarchy used in the model, the same coords used in ivtank00.xsi does not result in the same relative location in ivhtank00.xsi.
Change the number until its right! :-D
I find notepad-3dex is much better than threed for precise placement.
You should be able to add the parents value and get to the same place.
Stop insulting threed. I have used it to texture and edit every single model in the entire QF mod and they all work 100%!!!
Notepad is how you precisely place objects, and threed is to roughly place them.
It is frequently easier however, to just get them right in the original modelling program.
Threed is fine. It only currupts models when you hit the "save" button :D
And, IMO, If all your mod's models were made with Threed, your mod cannot be any better then SF mod.
No - not made with threed - the models were made in 3dsmax, then exported to xsi, opened in threed, textured, hps added, and saved.
Sometimes numbers get slightly corrupted, but it doesnt show in the game and is easy to fix in notepad if it causes problems.
Yes, but Why not add hps' and texture in 3ds max?
I'm not approximating. I open the model in threed, move the HP, save the model. Only 22 kb gets saved aout of 220kb. That is literally 10% of the model. The rest doesn't get saved.
On top of that, it f*cks my mouse up until I restart my pc.
Threed is a pos. It's not bad enough that it doesn't save the model. To add insult to injury, it tells me what sensitivity my mouse will run at.
If threed would display the coordinates of a Hardpoint without having to save the model, that would work perfectly. Unfortunately it doesn't even do that.
Quote from: General BlackDragon on July 22, 2008, 10:51:26 PM
Yes, but Why not add hps' and texture in 3ds max?
Because the exporter makes all the colours turn blue and they have to be edited in threed.
@Commando - that is because the dummyroot frame of the object has a texture. Its complicated but I have gotten the hang of it.
They arnt Really blue
thats just Threed viewing it INCORRECTLY.
and, I usually edit that in notepad. NOTTHREED
They are actually blue. Its just that bz2 doesn't show it.
Theed is good for people who know how to tame it. Its like a wild dog.
The color is cyan.
It's not a "wild dog"
more like a "3 legged horse" after you shoot it in the other leg...
I was able to correct the models using notepad and excel. Lets just say there were a lot of simple calculations that added up.
After about 2 hours, I got the eyepoint for the hover assault tanks and the heavy sabre placed at the correct location along with the light hardpoints. I also fixed the Assault Avenger too.
Thats nice. It would have taken 2 minutes in threed.
Except he already said thread destroyed his model.
Because he didn't do it right. The dummyroot object, or the top one can't have a texture.
Otherwise it ruins the object when you save.
It's not my model. It is one of GreenHeart's models that are in public beta 4.
Based on the coordinates displayed by 3D Exploration, the hardpoint, hp_eyepoint should be about 100% perfectly placed to be consistent with the sabre.
ThreeD fails for less.
Quote from: bigbadbogie on July 23, 2008, 04:34:45 AM
Because he didn't do it right. The dummyroot object, or the top one can't have a texture.
Otherwise it ruins the object when you save.
The model was setup fine however It is a bug in threed's saving process. I'm not going to change my ways just for a buggy piece of crap program that can't do anything right except crash or corrupt files. If the models were setup wrong then bz2 & 3d exploration along with other 3rd part viewers would have the same problems which they don't. I convert xsi to wrl or any other format without getting any kinda of corrupt reguardless of how the model is setup.
QuoteSometimes numbers get slightly corrupted
<- Proven to be a Buggy Piece of Crap.
QuoteOnly 22 kb gets saved aout of 220kb.
This quote above should be enough reason to not use Threed just because it has been proven to corrupt files. Any corruption in the xsi that goes unnoticed is bad for bz2 so i don't recommend using threed.
I still don't get why you'd want to add HPs using Threed since its a whole lot better to use 3d max. One thing i like doing to terrain__h, collision__hc, and any hp's is giving them a material that has no texture & setting the opacity to zero so it can't ever be shown ingame reguardless. Later if i want view the model really quick in 3d deep exploration those objects are automaticly hidden so i don't have to manually hide them to view the model.
Just because YOU can't use threed without problems doesn't mean that it is a piece of crap, just that you arent using it the way it is supposed to be used. Don't blame the program for your mistakes.
Boogie, MOST OF EVERYONE GETS SKREWED OVER BY IT.... been that way since. :P
f*ck! calm down! do we have to flame about EVERYTHING?!? i dont believe the question was about how useless or not Threed was...
Some alternatives would be useful, but I finished what I intented to do without the use of one.
Used Open Office's spread sheet to do the calculations then adjusted the coordinates in WordPad based on those calculations.
It was a pain in the rear, but it got the job done. I won't make the comment I was tempted to make as it will just escalate the threed debate.
As far as I know, GreenHeart's models don't have a dummyroot at all. Maybe there not being a dummyroot is causing the issue. Either way, it doesn't matter. Every other app works indicating GH is doing nothing wrong.
QuoteBecause he didn't do it right. The dummyroot object, or the top one can't have a texture.
Otherwise it ruins the object when you save.
Is that what causes the stock units to get trashed? interesting.
Far from the only cause.
I know most of them, made a post about it somewhere.
I didn't know what caused what most of a stock ship to vanish when you saved it though.
Ill test this when I get time.
You Know...Ages ago, and on my win 98 pc, Threed works. But then one day, the secret contract that sold it's sould to satan kicked in, and it turned evil on me....
Hasnt worked since...