unit collision detect

[GSH]

See http://www.bzuniverse.com/forum/index.php/topic,6310.0.html for one set of complaints.

-- GSH

[Red Devil]

Thanks, I'll look into it later this afternoon.

[Avatar]

(Pictures Red Devil setting up shop, pouring hot java for sleepy Sabre pilots and whipping up scrambled eggs loaded with tobasco...)



I would love to see the units all given the appropriate mass setting.  How much does an Attilla weigh, anyway?    To see Scion Scouts just bouncing off one as it wades through Scion defenses to take out their Matriarch...  sweet.

Jammers are an EXCELLENT example of a BAD building.  Heckfire, at the beginning they weren't even true buildings and you could drop a GS right on top of one.  (loved that, though...)  All those angles, hjgh center, no collision object, tracked vehicles slip right under it...

Think of a ball shoving its way under another ball, one that's set a bit higher than the first.  That's what's happening, squeezes it right inside.  And to make matters worse parts of the treaded units often 'stick out' of the sphere used for their collisions.  This is one of those buildings that would benefit a lot from a decent collision object, or altered CR.  It might actually even be great to have it spawn a vehicle-only-shoving MCurtain as a lung...  but we're straying into mod territory there...

boxCollide = 1 helps a lot for normal collisions with treaded units, especially those that are longer than they are wide, but it would be nice to have a little more help for them in low-speed bumps...

-Av-

[Red Devil]

I miss the jammers in GS's too.

"Javajavajavajava..." 

[llulla]

I'm trying to find out which ODF controls what. Only for ConstructionRig there are  like 10: iconsb, icontt, iconsw.... (maybe not exactly like this).  The same for other units: ivtank, ivtank12, ivtank_lw  .  Inside each there are no remarks to explain the difference. Please help!

[Raven]

They are used for the missions, some can't build certain things, some can and so on.
Ever noticed that some ships have different hardpoints in the missions? Well thats what those ODFs are for, they hav different weapons and maybe other speed/handling related stuff.
The first mission where you can command a rec (on pluto) has a different build menu, you can only build scavs, turrets and pods? Again, thats what it's for (Might have missed one out, I can't remember.)

Oh and there are also rec varients to think of

[Commando]

llula, I am sure the main difference between the different construction rigs is what they can build.  Basically what shows up on their build menus.

The following section within the construction rig's odf may be the main difference.

[ConstructionRigClass]
buildItem1 = "ibpgen"
buildItem2 = "ibfact"
buildItem3 = "ibcbun"
buildItem4 = "ibarmo"
buildItem5 = "ibsbay"
buildItem7 = "ibtrain"
buildItem8 = "ibtcen"
buildItem9 = "ibbomb"
[BuildGroup6]
buildlabel = "Defenses"
buildItem1 = "ibgtow"
buildItem2 ="ibbstow"
soundBuild = "ivrecye3.wav"
soundFinish = "ivrecye5.wav"

Avatar, I never noticed boxCollide=0 actually helping.  The scavs in fleshstorm still seemed to get caught on one another, even with this setting.

[llulla]

Na ah! That exact segment is in > 1 ODF for ConstructionRig. I am looking for ODFs that govern units ONLY in IA games.

Playing Canyons I came accross another instance of sleepy units but couldn't catch it . Two Sabres staying with the nose in the Extratctor while a Warrior melted it with the Arc. The moment Extractor was gone the Sabres took the Warrior out instantly.  :lol:Funny thing to see and a pitty I couldn't save it.

[BZZERKER]

Playing Canyons I came accross another instance of sleepy units but couldn't catch it . Two Sabres staying with the nose in the Extratctor while a Warrior melted it with the Arc. The moment Extractor was gone the Sabres took the Warrior out instantly.  :lol:Funny thing to see and a pitty I couldn't save it.

Were they told to defend a scav or extractor?

[Avatar]

Avatar, I never noticed boxCollide=0 actually helping.  The scavs in fleshstorm still seemed to get caught on one another, even with this setting.

Before adding it to the Phaer Ran Scavs they 'merged' when bumping into a deployed GT.  The front part of the nose would entomb with no resistance at all, and then the suction would begin. 

Adding it made them bump the second the nose hit, rather than later when the collision bubble hit.  They still merge at times but the 'bump' occurs at the nose, rather than part way down the body. 

Slow speed merging still occurs, as does merging if they're anywhere near the build point while one is being built.  (You have to wait for a bit for them to clear the build point as they first turn and head into the building for some reason.  The Phaer Ran Factory is even worse, Walkers will turn right around and try to force their way into the building before heading for the dropoff point.)

Merging with buildings such as deployed GT's occurs if they're stubbornly trying to ram through them, but once entombed if they're jostled just right they'll shoot up to the top of the GT collision and fall off.

Like I said, it doesn't fix everything but it helps the collision occur at the right spot, especially on treaded units that aren't squared off, like the Phaer Ran (longer than wide).

I wish debug.collision showed everything that collides, including vehicles.  I'd like to see it show the collision as red/blue boxes and bubbles, without hiding the geometry.  I think that would illustrate better what's going on, as I see a lot of the collision troubles as bubbles meeting bubbles.  IMO even making the bubbles into flat topped cylinders would be better, if more drag on the engine...

-Av-

[llulla]

Yes the tanks were told to guard the Extractor.

This  "boxCollide"  line goes to any specific place inside the ODF or doesn't matter.

BTW Avatar, I think you said something about upgraded Phaer Ran GTs  at Fleshstorm forum. I am circling around but not finding a way to do it.

[Avatar]

boxCollide = 1 goes under [GameObjectClass].

Ah, you've never played BZ1.  Use the Armory to drop weapon powerups on the GT's once they're deployed.  This is a BZ1 trick that doesn't work for stock BZ2 GT's.

The reason this works in Fleshstorm is that the GT's don't have a collision__hc object.  BZ2 doesn't specifically stop you from dropping new weapons on a GT, but with the stock GT's the weapon pod will hit the collision object and never actually touch the GT.

I think the reason it's this way is originally BZ2 used the mesh itself for collisions, but this is a very heavy load on the engine.  Collision objects were added to help with the load, and using a collisionRadius (bubble) is even less of a load.

For stock BZ2 there really aren't any better weapons to drop on a GT than what they come with, but for the Phaer Ran I've found the fireballs in the Incinerator" choice in the Armory (6-3) to be the best heavy hitting GT weapon.  They're a little slow but they take down the big enemies very nicely.  The stock pulse rockets do a good job on the Scuttles, so against the Swarm you might want a mix...

-Av-

[llulla]

I have BZ1 from day0 and continued to keep it for a long time in parallel with BZ2. The fact that I have not been regular in the forums is related to other reasons.

I tried what you are saying since the first time I read the post at FS but it seems my "aiming"isn't good enough or I am doing something wrong.   The pods keep bouncing under the GT. Maybe more practice needed .

[BZZERKER]

Yes the tanks were told to guard the Extractor.

I'm not sure why that would happen then.

I know that if you tell a unit (tank, scout) to follow another unit that deploys into a building (such as a Scav), the unit told to follow no longer has anything to follow when that other unit deploys and it's attention will drift off to Never Never Land.

[Avatar]

I have BZ1 from day0 and continued to keep it for a long time in parallel with BZ2. The fact that I have not been regular in the forums is related to other reasons.

Sorry, it just seemed like you didn't realize you could drop weapon powerups on buildings.  In my experience that usually means the person hasn't played BZ1.

I tried what you are saying since the first time I read the post at FS but it seems my "aiming"isn't good enough or I am doing something wrong.   The pods keep bouncing under the GT. Maybe more practice needed .

If that happens it's the wrong type of weapon.  The Phaer Ran armory is orgainized by what unit they go in.  It's only my own experimenting that found that the "Incinerator" weapons were cannon class and would drop into a GT.  Rockets, mortors, & guns will do what you mention, just drop through the unit and bounce on the ground beneath them.

Ah, sweet PYRO BLAST... 

-Av-