My 1.3 Strat Experience

[Avatar]

You're just not used to so much clarity,

which is a rarity,

at least around hereity... er?



-Av-

[sabrebattletank]

And that is the verity.

[trinsic]

I was wondering if someone could elaborate on a strategy to counter a Scion Base Defense with a Jammer. I read that scouts are a counter to the Jammer, but I dont see how you would be able to get in close enough for that to have any effect, as soon as you get with in range of their guard towers its over. Since I cant target the enemy buildings having a  scout paint the buildings for targeting could work but wouldnt they get taken out before you had time to do anything, it seems like a pretty complicated way of doing it as it is..

It seems like a jammer has serious balance issues... but I having figured out to how to counter them in a IA or MPI game..

[Axeminister]

jammers or not unbalanced. since you can't get close to buildings, you target spires, take out defenses with sabres and rocket tanks with the target given by scouts, then direct bomber and everything else to buildings as targets become closer and closer to main targets like matriarch. don't forget you can redirect bomber in-route in 1.3pb3, so as you clear targets ahead of it's flight, you can give it a new target mid-flight. it's step by step just like taking out defenses vs ISDF then their base. Don't forget that rocket tanks with hornet don't need a target to just start shooting at the closest thing in range. and as thugs swarm your offense that missle scouts with shadower missles to protect rocket tanks works very nicely.

[ScarleTomato]

and Sp tanks my man, all the way, they'll absolutley level an AI base. just send a couple squads in, while they're distracting, take out the jammers, and then you can coordinate the attack.

[trinsic]

Thanks guys, both good ideas, I did use scouts and they worked great for painting targets. thanks for the help.

[Bull Dog]

Game started out as usual, mostly involving dueling for control of the field with scouts and turrets. I tried to hover the enemy turrets but was unable to really do any damage with a minigun scout, instead having to resort to a gambit of hiding behind a pool while i moved my own into place. It worked. Later attempts at hovering were not the most successful, so I had to wait until tanks.

You do realize that while hovering doesn't work, circle strafing, ala BZ1 style does work, right?

[APCs r evil]

Scouts don't need to be in Gun Spire range to target things, they automatically target anything within their (450m) radar range.

ZA; are you in the 1.3 beta?

[Commando]

I thought he was at one point, but he doesn't appear to be in now.  If he was in, he probably left when all the other vets did.

[Spawn]

This is a bit old, but jammers can be beaten pretty easily.  Assault blast on a walker does quite well, as does having a friend paint the enemy recycler early on.  With an AI scout you can paint the spires, though I don't think you can kill the buildings.  The best strategy if scions spend a lot of scrap on jammers is to take the field with rocket tanks and turrets, or have a few missile scouts follow your tank to win fights there and starve the enemy.  ISDF turtle far better than scion, and can break one better too.  You can send in apcs, and if the enemy doesn't know how to stop them then they are kinda screwed.  Scions don't really have an effective anti air defense like the isdf does, so jammers are needed for that.

But if you don't have the field and can't make rocket tanks, then you are kinda screwed.

What map was it btw?

[General BlackDragon]

It was 2 months ago, i doubt he remembers

[Spawn]

You never know...
He also might have a log.

[Zero Angel]

It was remnant. The enemy cmdr had his secondary pool protected by spires and jammers so I was unable to bomb it, nor outrange it with rckt tanks. (Scions can easily survive on two pools, they just need to be effective with scavengers.) The enemy commander was arcing my turrets and sending scavs to clean up the loose. He forced me to fight for his 3rd pool since his base was jamming and rendering my attacks non-effective. I sent walkers at his base but they didnt stand a chance against so many gunspires. I did not try using hornet tanks like I probably should have, the rocket tanks I did have on the field were shadower/salvo ones designed to protect the turrets from arc cannon and mauler attacks.

[Red Devil]

Good grief.  Ever think of going on a game show?  You'd clean up.

[Spawn]

The rocket tanks are good with hornet, but you need a few with salvo mixed in.  Hornet isn't too effective on spires, but if you use the 400m range glitch then scions are kinda doomed.  Walkers should have no problem with spires, they just need a human pilot.  They have assault guns and cannons so you can pretty much destroy everything with the blast without getting into the spire's range.  Rocket tanks and chain rats help greatly here to cover you, salvo and chain for maulers and shads for blink help.

I'm assuming mdm didn't work because the enemy has sonic, though it is quite hard to defend a spire unless you aim well.

Also, a group of missile scouts with shadower are cheap and very effective in 1.3, they have good aim, you can pump them with a few upgrades and rape warriors nicely.  Cheaper than rocket tanks and faster to respond too.

If you knew about the scout trick it probably would have helped you, you could at least bomb the spires, but even so you could just bomb his third pool to at least keep him on two.  You also could have tried to tug the bomb, but that almost certainly would not have worked even with how amusing it would have been.

With the painting trick, you could have sent in some apcs against the spires, the pilots would have kept shooting at other things randomly even if  not at the jammer.  bomb one side, apc the other then mdm the con to piss him off

Scions have counters to most of these, though bomber is hardest.  You need to shoot the bomb or bomber, both aren't easy.  Against an apc raid static and acid destroys them, acid is slower and you need to have an archer on the bay first.  Acid also destroys light armor, like service trucks, so the walker can be countered by that, but if he didn't put an archer on the bay then you have nothing to worry about.  You could also try to paint the archer and bomb it, but that is harder.