Can the AI units negotiate things like a spiral ramps?

[BNG Da BZ Fool]

I made several of them by extruding along a helix path from a ramp object and I wanted to know if it will be worth making such props or if it's just a waste of time. Would using the standard ramp odf be sufficient to get the ai to use my spiral ramp? PS: If anybody can use the ramps let me know and I'll ul them on filefront so that they can be dl'ed. They'll more then likely be untextured, but if anybody request it I'll apply a simple cement texture to make them more appealing. PS: I have a ton of semi complete x model props available, but need to zip and ul the file to file front if anybody can use the stuff let me know...BNG

[bigbadbogie]

hehe - good luck

[Red Devil]

That's pretty cool.  It'd probably work if it was defined as terrain.  Besides, the AI can be a little screwy at times, so it might fit right in. 

[bigbadbogie]

but how is it going to scale the ramp?? it would need an ai path that goes around in a circle 4 times

[Avatar]

My understanding is that the AI is pretty much clueless about height...  they live in a 2D world...

So my guess is that it won't be as nice as they cruise right up the ramp.  Going down I'm sure they'd just jump down the middle, but up would be tough...

Still, to my knowledge it's never been done.  That means you HAVE to try it...   

-Av-

[CmptrWz]

Bet you could get them to go up ONE spiral with multiple objects and appropriate tunnel defs, but after that they would think they were done.

[bigbadbogie]

what i meant by 4 times was that the ship would go around in a circle 4 times.

to the ai it would just be going around in a circle, but the ship would actually be following the ramp to the top

[BNG Da BZ Fool]

I made the sides a bit raised on the left and right shoulders so they couldn't easily fall off the edges, but wasn't really sure whether they could be coax to start up or down the spiral to reach a nav beacon placed between the ramp and the nav beacon itself. I know the ai can cross bridges to get to a nav beacon but the ramp would need placement next to a piece of raised terrain like a cliff and placed directly next to it. I can also change the incline angle to be less steep if that would help the ai climb the ramp more easily too. PS: I can also extend the end part with a straight piece that could be added to extend the upper part for quite some distance as well, or construct a building that could be attached to form somekind of fortress structure or other useful prop. I'll have to try it and see what happens and post again if anything good results...BNG

Obtw, I believe incline angle is currently set to 15 degree.

[bigbadbogie]

i dont think that it matters what angle you set it to...just so long as the ships can get up it

[Avatar]

What Wiz said would probably work...  basically it'd be a series of tunnels all connected together, with the AI thinking:

"Go N one square in Tunnel 1"
"Go W one square in Tunnel 2"
"Go S one square in Tunnel 3"
...

That sort of thing.  That would mean making one tunnel object that was half of the spiral and connecting them to each other.  Imagine making a similar spiral out of the stock ramp tunnel objects... it'd be a lot wider but the AI should be able to use it.

I'd rather see an 'up' and a 'down', and use the ShieldTower object.  Any AI entering the thing would just swooooosh on through and be spit out the other end. 

-Av-

[BNG Da BZ Fool]

Bummer, the ai apparently don't have the brains to even attempt to climb my spiral ramps. I tried both terrain and tunnel odfs, but to no avail. Human pilots can negociate the ramp but with some difficulty as well, i.e., a lot wall bumping and falling off the edges of the ramp. Oh well, chalk one up for just another pretty piece of eye candy to decorate the lonely lanscape of BZ land...BNG

[Avatar]

A single odf for the entire spiral won't work, it'd have to be split up into segments, each one being half of one spiral level.  Your image would end up 5 and 1/2 tunnels...  the same way a full bridge is made up of two ends and some segments.

Each piece would be 180 degrees of one level of the spiral, basically:  (pardon my trashy text graphics)

(top view)
_____________________
I                                I
I      _____________     I
I      I                   I     I

From the side they'd be a ramp...  the AI would see them more like a staircase that cuts back on itself... otherwise you'd have to do quarters  like:

____________
I
I      ________
I      I
I      I

This would be four pieces per level, or 11 for the figure you show.

See?

-Av-

[BNG Da BZ Fool]

Tanks for the suggestion. I'll give it a try first halves then quarters and try the ai out on these again. Seems like making the stuff is the easy part; getting it to work right is a whole nother en-chi-lada. Just need to adjust the controls to produce 90 or 180 extruded pieces. The odf I used was pbtun03 with a single tunnel count. I may also try the 2 for the ib bridge strut and segment odfs to see what happens. As a simple test I made a simple straight bridge type placed it between a mote type terrain lowered thingy got on one end of the bridge placed an fvscout and fvtitan on the other end and commanded them to move toward my positon and the results were this. The scout dived into the mote thingy and got stuck but the titan crossed the bridge just fine to join me on the other side. What are some of the other odfs I cann experiment with to possible get the spiral ramp to work better? Tanks BNG

[Zero Angel]

Oh man, if you want to do anything with a spiral tunnel, good luck!

Might want to read my tunnel guide if you want to make 'tunnel' entries in your ODF that your AI will go through.

I once made a building called a 2-story building called a 'command nexus'. The ODF required a whopping 16 tunnel entries. And AI soldiers could enter and leave it through its doors, but weren't so good at going back and forth between the first and second floors.

Usually if you ran to the second floor, they would be waiting on the first floor and immediately start attacking you when you entered the stairwell. 

[Red Spot]

Imo you could this working just fine ... using a good model with good collision boxes and a good set of tunnel .odf's ..
Though I cant help feel you're beter of not using it, as it is the AI already has some issues with staying inside tunnels already and I dont think you can (almost) completelly remove the exidental bumping out of the tunnel ..

You can easilly make a sort of similair thing with terrain though, than connect the top with a plain bridge to an other part of the map, would have the same effect .. get up a ramp, spiral around a lot, to get there where you can get to an other part of the map ..
(its that I've seem to have misplaced all my BZ2-work else I could have shown you a map where I did exactly that .. the whole map was filled with huge spirals with at some pools on top others bridges to the other 1/2 of the map ..)


G