Upgrading weapons

[bb1]

We've been over this countless times: not going to happen.

[Nielk1]

We've been over this countless times: not going to happen.

Really? Never noticed. I've never found much of anything said about BZE before, so I would have no idea if it was ever said before, since it was not said here. EVER.

I mean, I don't know about this case, but in my experience in two situations converting my code to use external files when it used to be hard coded was nothing more than mapping out a plan and taking the time to do it. Those were not compiled DLLs but all the same I don't have the most experience.

Bet OM could do it, if he ever had time and wanted to.

[bb1]

Oh. It has been requested at BZC and OC and sector zero many many times, each dismissed as too much work not enough pay off or just not possible on the engine, or some combination of each. I'm not totally sure on the reason.

[Nielk1]

Indeed, there are too few programming modders to justify the payback.

[ssuser]

Yes, I think that would be the best option, recode the game to be able to pick up and load a compiled dll, I don't think much could be effectively added by tweaking the instant action code module as it stands - there just isn't much you could do with it without tying into a LOT of complexity in a big hurry.

In order for ppl to use it someone would also have to build a utility like the DLL Scripter for bz2 as well, if they expected any good IA missions to be authored - I don't believe anyone is going to sit down and write 20-30 KB of C++ code for one IA mission.

I think this would be doable, as Brad Pickering said awhile back that is one thing he would have liked to do with the bz1 code, along with having the game read assets straight out of ZIP files, which would be convenient.

Dx, that brings another question to mind I was meaning to ask you at some point. I know you are limited in how many assets you can stuff into the zfs as you have had to remove some things along the way. But - what if there were a way to have multiple asset loads for the game? By which i mean you could have several sets of assets that could be selected from the shell when first starting the game, and you would then have access to a specific set for IA, DM and strat for the duration of the session. In this way you could have a classic stock asset version, the BZE version, maybe a TRO version, and so on. In this way one game (BZE) would allow for the creation of all kinds of mods using all races and so on depending on which set you were working with. I don't know how practical this would be and it would obviously increase the size of the game considerably, but you could have the different asset packs set up as separate downloads so people could grab what they wanted as needed.

[Dx]

If dll's get made it's not up to me, as i don't know how to do it. Not sure what bb1 is going on about. It's not like Bz has coders jumping out of the wood work to help work on bz code. No one is really interested but the hackers.

Ssuser BzE is striped down because the stock sp mission assets are removed. Adding to the zfs is not a problem, (now that i have the code) i added to memory.
But with the game turning into bloatware, how would i find and fix problems with soo much more that could be the problem, too much to back track. I want to keep it small and simple for now.

As for what Brad wanted to do... i would rather have the game secure from hackers than have it fully open and have hacks.

[ssuser]

Ah, I see, so it could be done. I can see your point about keeping it simple though, and there are not many who would work on code now, as you point out. Still an intriguing idea though.

[Vid]

Yeah, there is not much flexibility in the game scripts, they will chug along even when you try to play "out of the box" mostly, this is to "bulletproof" the missions and keep them from hanging when the player tries something strange.

One hangup I found - on the second Mars mission (at the volcano) the CCA recycler is off the map, but not TOO far off. I had a really souped up Scout available with a huge radar scan and some REALLY long range heatseeker missiles, and just for fun I put it in the recycler odf and used it to blow up the entire off-the-map CCA base. The CO then said, "General, Grizzly One has destroyed the CCA recycler!" After that nothing happened - the bombers never showed and the mission never ended, lol.

That's interesting... I destroyed the recycler once with splinter mortars that fired rocket bombs... but couldn't find a way to get rockets over there.  Despite tripling shotspeed and lifespan, my hornets die out before they make the 900 distance to the factory.  I never was good at editing odf files though, so perhaps I was missing something.

[bb1]

An insanely fast firing tracer of enormous damage that fires 1e-6 with a .001 fire rate WILL hit it.

Of consequence, I theorize a weapon with ammo cost 0 and shot delay 0 will crash the game when fired, if not when the game is launched with the weapon in place. Not sure, I just thought it was interesting but never tried it out.

[ssuser]

Vid - since they were heatseekers they may have just dipped down and hit the geyser between the legs of the factory - that is a unit you have to get just the right angle on, and heatseekers go nuts for the huge heat sig of geysers. Also, if you set the coneAngle too wide, they will fly off and go for things you weren't aiming at. Rocket bombs from splinters... lol. You should have put the rave balls in - they are prettier. 

bb1, you should try the zero-delay gun and report back to us. One thing I know that will crash the game is if you set the radar scan range to zero - I have tried this.

[Dx]

Sounds like a divide by zero float crash thingy.

[Vid]

They actually looked like they were disappearing, like any shot that went 600m out of my range disappeared or something.  However I'll try again with imagemsl. 

[Avatar]

*cough*DAYWRECKER*cough*

My ramblings:

I've tried very hard to outline all of the different things that can happen in the original missions, but it's impossible to get them all...   

I've tried hard to NOT fix everything, as some of the odd things that happen are cool, like Flying Furies pushing Fury Tanks into view at lightspeed.  (last mission did this to me, very startling...)

In that mission I think they say "I'm picking up something BIG on your radar" when you get close to the first Golem, no matter where it is.   They also barely attack, and when they do dual SP's and a small hill are all you need, or a Splinter.   It's also the only mission where I've had Golems shoot me with poppers when they die.  Not sure how/why that happens and it seems like it only happens in unpatched play...

Eldridge and friends running over to your base...  very cool idea that I'm stealing as I type... 

I've used the HARD difficulty setting in BZC to release my inner demons...  things are fixed, more attacks, bases rebuild themselves, the player is targeted, all while trying to keep things roughly the same.  By that I mean no Golems in earlier missions, no waves of Furies or Rave Tanks.  Just more attackers, varied groups, and from random directions.

Yes, I think that would be the best option, recode the game to be able to pick up and load a compiled dll,

*cough*BZC*cough*   Seriously, while I love the BZ1 physics and feel, and grudgingly admit that BZ2 (so far) can't seem to capture that magic, I do think the move to another engine is worth it just for the DLL/Scriptor capabilities alone.  That's without mentioning the effects system, the smarter AI (no Scav Traps!!!) and the new classes (aircraft!  assault hover! morphing!).

-Av-

[Vid]

Vid - since they were heatseekers they may have just dipped down and hit the geyser between the legs of the factory - that is a unit you have to get just the right angle on, and heatseekers go nuts for the huge heat sig of geysers. Also, if you set the coneAngle too wide, they will fly off and go for things you weren't aiming at. Rocket bombs from splinters... lol. You should have put the rave balls in - they are prettier. 

bb1, you should try the zero-delay gun and report back to us. One thing I know that will crash the game is if you set the radar scan range to zero - I have tried this.

I upped the ammo so it would make one full turn of rocket bombs... its scary to lay a mits mine, fire 4 splinters into it, then leave the soon to be nuked area.  I supercharged shadower the same way I did hornet and they worked on the factory/recycler, so I'm thinking you were right and the hornets were hitting geysers.

It's fun to put all sorts of things on splinters....   rave shots, Mag full charge shots, sp stabs, rocket bombs(duck or you'll be nuked), regular mortars(ground nuke), and popguns(30-40 of these from a  splinter = dead enemy in an instant).

I keep a stock addon folder for when I'm not playing around.

[ssuser]

Vid, missile flares will disappear after they get far enough away, not sure what the actual range for that is. To get a sure kill, try adding mega splash damage to your custom Hornets (look at the rocket bomb odf for ideas), this will  really increase their killing power.

Av, Dx sent me a zip containing just the single player and IA mission code a while back when we were trying to figure out how to improve upon the default instant action code - it does contain some useful info on the hidden/unused stuff in the missions. I can't post it up since it's proprietary code and I will respect Dx's wishes on keeping this stuff secret, but I bet if you ask him real nice he would send you the zip, or I can send it if he gives permission in a subsequent post.

I would love to see some of the unused stuff implemented for BZC - for example, the search for the CCA test range and the run thru the mines and encounter with the CCA experimental tank on the first Venus mission. I don't know where this would go on the map though.

The Walkers firing the poppers is mission specific and based on a weaponMask change right in the C++ code - that's why you never see them doing it in any other map.

I always try to use my MDM mortar for knocking out Walkers - it is pretty effective once you practice the technique, and you can engage them this way starting at about 250 meters on relatively flat ground, or if you have MAG Cannons, these are also very effective. Gotta keep away from them Blast Cannons...