Who is God?

[Feared_1]

You do have a lot to lose if you are wrong, the small amount of time you have here would be wasted.  You also should not assume your own time to be worthless, or it will be

A belief is not wasted time to the believer. Telling a Christian that they may be wrong in their beliefs is almost an insult. You refute ideas and thoughts. You can't refute beliefs. This is because the believer is basing his/her argument on what he/she believes to be fact and has probably done so for a very long time.

Belief ≠ Idea or thought

There is a difference between telling someone, "I believe the storm will hit us." and "I think the storm will hit us."

[Darkplanet01]

A belief is not wasted time to the believer. Telling a Christian that they may be wrong in their beliefs is almost an insult. You refute ideas and thoughts. You can't refute beliefs. This is because the believer is basing his/her argument on what he/she believes to be fact and has probably done so for a very long time.

Belief ≠ Idea or thought

There is a difference between telling someone, "I believe the storm will hit us." and "I think the storm will hit us."

And in my case, I base what I believe to be fact on the available evidence. And telling us we are wrong in our beliefs could be classified as an insult in some terms, but in many cases it is taken as an opportunity to witness to somone.

[sabrebattletank]

*Shakes head*
Christianity is only a religion by some definitions. If religion is any belief in a supreme being, then yeah, Christianity fits. If religion is a set of rules, a code that must be followed to earn your way to heaven, then Christianity is NOT religion.

What that definition of religion implies is that Christians believe in a heaven in the clouds with little angels flying around and everyone worshiping God for all eternity. If you look at Jesus' teachings, he emphasizes that the Kingdom of God is "at hand" -- implying that it's not about a heaven up in the clouds, but about life on Earth.

As for religion doing more harm than good; if there is no belief in God, then there is no need for a belief in morals. As a result, nothing is wrong. Therefore, people have no conscience about murder, rape and any other wrong thing. It is no concidence that the decline in Christian teachings has been followed with the incline in crime rates, abortion, etc.

That's also not entirely true either -- Immanual Kant devised a moral system without the use of God. In fact,  Kantian morality is more strict in terms of behavior than Christian ethics in many several instances.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categorical_imperative

[Red Devil]

"at hand" meant that the Son of God was standing in front of them.

[sabrebattletank]

Then why is the subject of the sentence "The Kingdom of God" and not "The Son of Man?"

[Feared_1]

What that definition of religion implies is that Christians believe in a heaven in the clouds with little angels flying around and everyone worshiping God for all eternity. If you look at Jesus' teachings, he emphasizes that the Kingdom of God is "at hand" -- implying that it's not about a heaven up in the clouds, but about life on Earth.

This made me laugh.

First of all, there is more than one religion in the world. The definition of religion doesn't include "Christian anything". It includes ALL religions.

I'm not sure what you mean by the second part. It seems to me that your logic is waaaay off. The Kingdom of God means heaven, so I don't know where you get this life on earth thing.

(Thesaurus: "at hand" = Imminent. In other words, the Kingdom of God is coming. In other words, the end of the world is coming. This being the time when Jesus comes back the second time to rapture his church.)

[Red Devil]

Because it is by the Son of God that you reach the Kingdom of Heaven.

Then why is the subject of the sentence "The Kingdom of God" and not "The Son of Man?"

[sabrebattletank]

This made me laugh.

First of all, there is more than one religion in the world. The definition of religion doesn't include "Christian anything". It includes ALL religions.

Exactly -- I obviously did not phrase that right. What I'm saying is that by defining a religion as a code that leads you to heaven, you automatically exclude belief systems that do not acknowledge a heaven as implied by the definition. One interpretation of Christianity does not define heaven as that thing in the sky; many people see heaven as what will come to pass when all the world is converted: the resulting Kingdom where everyone lives Christian ideals. That is one common interpretation of Jesus' "at hand."

Dictionary:

at hand,
a.    within reach; nearby; close by. -> this Earth. Heaven is on Earth.
b.    near in time; soon.
c.    ready for use: We keep a supply of canned goods at hand.

[Feared_1]

Dictionary:

at hand,
a.    within reach; nearby; close by. -> this Earth. Heaven is on Earth.
b.    near in time; soon.
c.    ready for use: We keep a supply of canned goods at hand.

I believe the second definition there is the one we're looking at.

Exactly -- I obviously did not phrase that right. What I'm saying is that by defining a religion as a code that leads you to heaven, you automatically exclude belief systems that do not acknowledge a heaven as implied by the definition. One interpretation of Christianity does not define heaven as that thing in the sky; many people see heaven as what will come to pass when all the world is converted: the resulting Kingdom where everyone lives Christian ideals.

"Heaven is an afterlife world". I'm pretty sure that every dominant religion to ever exist had an afterlife consisting of two sides: paradise and torture (excluding those who believe in reincarnation). So really no one (except for Atheists) is left out. Heaven is not in this universe. It is a completely different place. Because of this, you can't really give it an "up in the sky" direction.

Christians have paradise (Heaven) and torture (Hell). There is a little trick to this, though. It is by the GRACE of God that a Christian is saved. Not by a "code" that has to be followed. Jesus died for our sins, therefore we are saved. Those who do not believe this are not. It's that simple. No codes required.

You're thinking of the New Jerusalem when you say "what will come to pass when the world is converted". That's paradise, but not the Kingdom of Heaven (if I'm correct... Revelations is a confusing book).

[Spawn]

I have a slight feeling none of you understood my point...

So I will explain it...when I am less tired.

Av: I didn't get the end of time bandits, I laughed, but was there some deeper meaning to the parents exploding?

[mrtwosheds]

It'd be the same thing as asking me if the sky is blue or if water is wet

The sky is not blue. Diffused sun light filtered by the atmosphere is perceived as blue, by human eyes.
Water is not wet. Your skin feels wet when it gets water on it.

Its tempting to respond to some of the other opinions here, but I am just going to return to my state of mild despair at just how easily young humans can be brainwashed into believing such total rubbish.

Just one little point, Its only humans who go to heaven/hell? Right? presumably all the other beings just get what I said we all do? Right?

[TheJamsh]

Not a clue...

But im 19, so not that young, and no one around me has these beliefs. Quite the opposite.. no brainwashing here.

[Avatar]

I have a slight feeling none of you understood my point...

So I will explain it...when I am less tired.

Av: I didn't get the end of time bandits, I laughed, but was there some deeper meaning to the parents exploding?

Not that I know of...  it's never good to analyze a Terry Gilliam work too deeply.

If anything I thought it sortof meant the kid was going off the deep end, like the ending of Total Recall.  Leaves you wondering if it's just in his head or really is reality.

***

Back on topic, I find it almost a universal truth that the young are less spiritual and more cynical when it comes to intangibles than older people.  I myself was more Mr. Spock than Dr. McCoy when younger, but am now probably 1/2 Spock and 1/2 McCoy.  (less concerned with logic and facts and more open to there being more to the Universe than can be measured.)

The only real proof I can offer on my behalf will come with age and experience.  I hate to keep playing the old man but it's true, you'll one day have experienced enough odd things to make you really doubt that the scientists have anywhere near the whole picture. 

-Av-

[cheesepuffly]

im 15, but the universe points too God. My parents do not force this on me but yeah.

[sabrebattletank]

You're thinking of the New Jerusalem when you say "what will come to pass when the world is converted". That's paradise, but not the Kingdom of Heaven (if I'm correct... Revelations is a confusing book).

Yes, Revelations is a confusing book, but it is a book with a historical context and written for a specific purpose. None of us (I'm pretty sure) are John The Apostle (by tradition, the author of Revelations), but Pope Benedict XVI recently released a statement on this very topic.

The seer of Patmos, identified with the apostle, is granted a series of visions meant to reassure the Christians of Asia amid the persecutions and trials of the end of the first century.

And yes, I do know that many Christians are not Catholics and therefore do not listen to the Pope. Take it or leave it.