On Thin Ice (Mission 11 single player)

[Dirty Rooster]

"The key for me was to build 1 scav and get it to the biometal pool, then crank out 4 turrets before the next scav", says Gamenut.

Only with game.cheat bzfree ON is this possible.

[Aegeis]

Rooster I think he meant he *gradually* cranked out 4 turrets with whatever scrap he was able to pick up.

[Dirty Rooster]

1 scav ... to pool.
So nothing to pick up scrap with,
hence
Time to get scav onto pool +
10 seconds pool warmup before extraction +
20 seconds for 20 scrap + 60 seconds for next 20 green scrap,
= First turret.

[Aegeis]

Well then........

*C*H*E*A*T*E*R*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!


           

[Der Vampyr Engel]

I thought that was the problem gamenut420, once you save it you will get a few variations then the Scion Charge comes in way too fast.

The thing is it only took me a few goes to do it in 1.2 although the first time I played 1.2 it was a copmplete shock but what I did was not to set up any scavs on the pool nearer the hill . I set up the scav's on the pool way at the back and on the biometal pool near the Drop point , then crank oput turrets and place them in a haphazard manner so any charges from the Scions would end up in complete confusion.


I would say though, it would be quite a good tatic say that the Scions let you build up your base, giving you a false sense of security, only sending in a few Sentries, Scouts and Warriors just to probe your defenses, so the player gets a false sense of Security, then Suddenly start sending in squads on Titans and Maulers to attack your main guns while sending in the smaller hover units to cause havoc in the player's base, not only that, the player gets attacks onto their base where the player hasn't bothered to reinforce so that the player's base suddenly comes under intense attack from the Scion's base.

This forces the player eventually to attack the Scion base, the Scion Base would be very heavily fortified with Spire Guns and Turrets, not to mention the Scion Unit's strategically placed in the base, especially the Heavy Units so it would be that much tougher to take the base instaed of just  taking the base in a tank rush.

What do other's think? problalby inviting some flames from people but since this is a beta well I might as well suggest it

[Jwk the Hemp Monkey]

Sounds like FE

[Der Vampyr Engel]

i played FE JTHM but I more like the way the Uler Mod was done, it's hard but fair.

I can handle the missions in that, not all of them but quite  few of them and although hard I love the way you get enough units to handle the problem and I also love the way the enemy units come in thick and fast, they attack your big guns and units that can stop them from getting into your base and I like that, it tests how good a base builder/commander you are and how good you are at cranking out service trucks and haviong them and your guns defended., after all, that is what a well armed and determined enemy would do they would try to destroy your big guns so that they can get at your units.

I understand the thing about sending in lots of Scions if your stupid enough to set a Drop Point very near to their Base!!!! I am suprised you don't get a real rush  out of the base, every unit just comes out at flattens you, your recycler, your turret ,your scout, everything and I am supriesd they haven't set up quite a lot of turrets there in the first place. That is why I would prefer it if you could deploy your recycler somewhere else, set up your base then crank out some units undeploy the recycler and then go to the Drop Point if you must.

Also if you do got to the Drop and manage to set up a base then the Scions attacks on your base should be extremely intense as you are near their base!!!!!!!!!Depending on who is their commander they might lull you into a false security or they might simply start attacking you with large numbers instantly when they see a considerable force move into that area near their base.

Still I thought that might be a way to go rather than just attack you in the way it is one now, it still would be quite a challenge as your base would be subjected to quite heavy attacks, I am trying to get into the DLL script via DLL Scripter so I could change it and test out to see if that approach would work. That is what I thought was wrong in BZ1 when you play the CCA Mission on Titan and you  have to destroy the Black Dog Walker, 2 Longbow Units, and a turret. It starts of great, you get the bombers attacking your Recycler, you even get the occasional tanks attacking the base but then all you get is the predictable attack of 3 light tanks and a scout , all incoming from one place rather than attacks coming in from different places,

Still just a thought that would be nice to see that, more heavy attacks on your base's so that your forced to build good heavy defences more often,

In my mod, when it get' finshed (I will need a programmer for mulitplayer) thenat would be what I would be striving for.

[MowerMan]

I had instances where I was getting attacked by like 20 Scions as soon as I deployed my recycler.  I just replayed from my save game, and I got an attack force that was much more managable.  Yes, building turrets is the key (you must "decoy for the turrets too, use mortars to attract a lot of the enemy, as they will always attack their attacker), but BZ2 is very unpredictable, and you can play from the same savegame, and he attacks will come in slightly varied.  Some of the charm of BZ2.

Once you survive the first attack wave, you can get GT's up pretty fast, as scap becomes plentifly.

If you build some GT's by the crash site (as close as you can to the ridge), they will destroy the guardians that spawn and deploy in the path to the pick-up point.

I deploy my rec right next the the pool cclosest to the crash site.  You can stash the transport in the pocket in the hills right there, and it will be pretty safe.

[gamenut420]

In response to Dirty Rooster and Aegeis:
I like to finish the game properly before cheating. I will run it again this weekend, I may have mistaken the number of turrets as I ran this on Sunday night and posted on Wednesday. I am running 1.2, I don't know if the scrap collection time from the pools is different than 1.3. I am not real confident about "beta" patches although this one seems to be well proven. I plan on trying 1.3 after I complete the game in 1.2 (I hate the fact that I cannot just install it over 1.2, personal issue).
I'll post results as soon as I finish, cheated results are pretty useless.

[Der Vampyr Engel]

Yes Mowerman that happens with me as well, as soon as I depoly the Rec I ususally lose my ship even if I cut the AVI of the Dropship and even if I get a way from them there are at least that amount of Scions about, even if I snipe a couple they still manage to attack my Rec, as a matter of fact that triggers them to attack because they stop and then after I snipe a few then thet simply attack the REC

[APCs r evil]

DVE - Just a note: The reason I said deploy far from the pool has nothing do do with surviving the first rush. I advised this because the base-building gets very difficult around that pool

A simple way to fix that is to deploy the recycler adjacent to the pool, the game will not allow you to build near the pool if the rec isnt adjacent because the pool is lower in the ground then the rest of the area, and is locked at that height because of the pool. Basically you cant build near it because the rec and pool are at different heights and the constructor will try to build at the same height the rec is on, this doesnt work near the pool because as i said before it is lower in the ground than the rest of the area and locked at that height. If you deploy the rec adjacent to the pool however you can build near it because the rec and pool are at the same height. And since the terrain near the ice is already separrated from the base area because it is too rough, you wont have to worry about the same thing happening near the ice. This will give you plenty of room for a full base on this mission since the highest in the tech tree you can go is the armory.

[Spawn]

well, im not sure about this, but if it follows the normal aip plans for the most part, the comp should just send scavs out (and stuff accross ice) so you can move the recycler to anywhere you want, itll just be a bit harder to get back pools and first rush may be a bit bigger.  But this doesnt always work that well...as apc knows (im so happy im about to throw up)

[APCs r evil]

The rush seemed the same to me when i deployed the recycler adjacent to the pool I even fought them all off with just four turrets and myself as a distraction, didn't lose a single unit in the process either.

[gamenut420]

I ran the scenario again yesterday.   There was NO WAY I could get the four turrets with one scav as previously stated. DIRTY ROOSTER called me on it and I was incorrect.  I started this about five seperate times, and the only way I could get four turrets was to build two scavs, take care of the two scouts myself, and I could have four turrets when the first attack wave hits. I also rush to the hill that has two sentries and a warrior hiding behind, take out the sentries with mortar, then snipe and steal the warrior. This helps with the scouts since the warriors lasers (second weapon) are more powerful and faster than the machine gun on the tank.

[PhoeniX-FlamE]

the "laser" warior has is ion gun amd the "machine gun" is minigun